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Supernatural – Episode 10.04 – The Gripe Review

1 Nov 2014

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“I wonder what Kate is doing,” said no one in the fandom.

Welcome to the Gripe Review for episode 4. Someone should pay me for this one because I would have never wasted my time watching this episode had it not been for this review. It's because of your comments and discussions here, they are too precious for me to forego.

It’s filler week which - following the trend set by Sera Gamble and perfected by Carver - is tantamount to throwaway episode week. Also, the episode is written by Adam Glass, which means we're sure to get one thing: exposition.

In my post season 9 plots review, in the gripe titled “The return of who-gives-a-f*cks,” I discussed the recent fad of SPN writers bringing back forgettable, shoestring characters and pretending the audience begged for it. Some of those characters, like Charlie, received this treatment so many times they became circus performers who keep leaving the stage and coming back for encore. Some like Kate are so obscure people have to be reminded who they are.

I wished I could tell the writers to stop doing this, that many of us don’t care about their brain children as much as they do. In seasons past it used to be memorable people like Meg, Crowley, Gabriel, Becky, and Anna who made comebacks, mostly for plot related reasons. Now I wouldn’t be surprised if the next filler episode was advertised to feature the motel clerk from episode 43, accompanied by exclamations of, “Oh, gee willy! Isn’t that exciting? Bet you guys were waiting for him all along.”

Let’s examine something. Picture this scene:


Now this dialogue:

Dean: Remember Kate, the werewolf girl we let live? Any ideas what happened to her?

Sam: I heard she stayed kosher for a while, until her sister Tasha got sick. They say Kate turned her to save her life. Tasha then went bad and started killing so in the end Kate had to stab her.

Dean: That’s sad, man. Poor kid! Hey, what's this? The mark on my arm is glowing…
*proceed with episode about why the MoC is glowing on Dean’s arm*

There, I summarized this entire episode in one short dialogue, and added an opening for a much better filler, one that features our heroes and involves the current mythology.

I understand the necessity for fillers. What I don’t understand is the insistence to make them so far removed from the main storyline that, after replacing a few lines of dialogue here and there, they could work in any season. Did we really need to know about Bitten to understand Paper Moon? I guarantee you no since I bleached my brain from that godawful episode – the worst episode in the history of the show IMO – and didn’t have any problems following Adam’s paint-by-numbers script.

I’m going on gripe mode for this one because it deserves it, and because there weren’t any worthwhile characters for a decent character review. Cas was absent; Crowley was absent, and Sam and Dean played background music to Kate’s Exposition Bonanza. I’ll get to their bits shortly but first, lets talk about the gripes.


Gripe #1: Stop talking!

There’s a part early on when Sam and Dean interview a witness of the werewolf attack at the bar. I fast forwarded through this, then rewound it, fearing I might miss something. My fear proved baseless because, in the end, the only thing that came out of that long, bang-your-head-against-the-table interview was that the culprit was in a barn. This could have been written in a passing scene, with a far more interesting character, like a hick with an accent or a bartender with an attitude, throwing the information around while the boys snatched it and ran with it.

In a TV show, visuals and quality of dialogue are as important as the story, yet I get a feeling these keep falling through the cracks in SPN’s writers room in favor the shortest, most obvious rout to the tale’s finish line. It’s a shame because this show used to be so good at using visuals to create parallels and imply meaning. Remember the Impala story in Swan Song? That’s quality we once had and lost in the second half of a decade.


Gripe #2: Stop talking while showing!

In the long sequence at the diner where brains go to die, we were forced to sit through Kate’s story with no way out and no possibility of skipping since it was pretty much the entire episode. Sam and Dean were as trapped as we were except this was their show which they spent listening to other people talk.

What riled me most about Kate’s story though, was that it was both shown and told. If this is a TV show, not a radio play or printed text, the creators have the advantage of putting the script on film. Why saddle it with a narration that tells us exactly what we see on screen? Why not just show the images, or take it one step further and use the narration as a clever device? Why not have Kate lie, or omit parts of the truth while we see the real story on our screens? Have Kate claim she didn’t turn her sister, or have her vilify herself by saying she did it for kicks, then show us how shattered she was when looking at her injured sister and how desperately she wanted to save her. All these scenarios would have been better than "Here is what happened, and here is the story of what happened, in words." Kate also would have earned an extra layer of personality, and a chance at our sympathy, if they had added that twist instead of boring us to death with her dull monologue.


Gripe #3: Bending character and logic for plot

The way the final encounter played out was a mind boggling exercise of characters and the laws of universe obeying plot. Sam and Dean got easily overpowered by two baby werewolves in the first half. They spent that entire time being shoved around so the sisters could have their heart to heart. Once the talk and stabitty stab was over – behind a closed door so neither of them could see – they came out of their funk and casually finished off the bad guys. How did those dudes get the best of them in the bedroom if it was so easy to kill them in the living room? Why were they just standing around, or lying on the ground, listening to Kate and Tasha? Why did they wait exactly the right amount of time for Kate and Tasha to finish their conversation before wrapping things up?


Gripe #4: Put it in the waste basket, not the recycle bin

Not only was the plot spoon fed to us, with things a child could deduce being pounded into our heads, (Sam in the diner, about what Kate did: “It was all just an act, to protect Tasha.” Thank you Dr. obvious! I didn’t get that from her tall tale,) it’s also a recycled plot. Think back to Benny, how he went straight only to have to face down a loved one (his ex-girlfriend) gone rogue, and forced to kill her. Didn’t something similar also happen between Kate and her boyfriend/best friend in Bitten? How about Bobby and his wife? Some might say these are parallels, a theme for the show. It’s about family members and lovers having to make sacrifices for the greater good, much like Sam and Dean have done so many times. But parallels have a time and a place, and when they happen to characters we care about they have the desired impact. Characters whom we don’t give two shakes of a flamingo’s tail about, in stories we see the ending from miles away, no longer carry that effect. Theirs becomes a cheap paperback that needs to be thrown in the waste basket and not in the recycle bin.


Gripe #5: Sam and Dean having moments of yawn

Since we’re back to the good old SPN formula, the episode had many good old Sam and Dean moments. In fact, it was loaded with them, which gave it a jarring quality when it also plowed through the werewolf story. There were scenes where, in the middle of a conversation about demonic transformations and guilty consciences, Kate would call to tell them they'd never see her again, and we’d wonder where to look and what to focus on.

My main problem with the Sam and Dean scenes however was that I couldn’t understand where they were going with them. Was the subject of the brotherly angst Dean’s demon transformation or Sam’s once again dangerous tilt toward the dark side? They oscillated between these two like a ping pong game. Was it a challenge for the two of them, a sort of who-is-guiltier-than-whom world cup championship? Not that it’s implausible for them to toss accusations around after what they went through, but it was unsatisfying to say the least since it prevented them from going any deeper than the surface into either subject to have a true heart to heart conversation and really take apart what happened.

I confess, I wanted them to solely focus on Dean’s demonic experience, since I felt it didn’t get its just deserts this season. I was fishing for anything, even an analysis of the trauma, to feed that void, but the show threw everything and the kitchen sink in there with it, including a lampshade of Jared’s arm in the sling and what Sam did with Lester. I know that one is important and will likely come up in the future when the show inevitably, unsurprisingly, turns its focus to Sam. But maybe it could have waited for one more episode, when we were well and truly over Demon Dean.

Speaking of DD…


Gripe #6: We lost Demon Dean for this?

I already talked at length about how disappointed I was with the way they ended Dean being a demon. What adds insult to injury is that they followed it with subpar material like this. It reminds me of season 7 when, after an explosive season opener and second episode, they divested themselves of the brimming-with-potential Godstiel, and the bone chilling Leviathan Cas, and dumped us in a damp laundry basket called “Girl Next Door.” I’m tempted to yell at the showrunners: Fine, it’s your show. Destroy all the anticipation we built over the summer, and all the juicy scenarios we churned in our heads. Take them all away after two-three episodes, we won’t complain. But does it have to be followed by this garbage? Do we have to feel bored on top of miserable and disappointed?

My overall impression of the episode: Unnecessary, boring, full of exposition and bland characters, wouldn’t have watched it if it wasn't for the review and my lecherous craving for the following comments/conversation.

Kudos: The only thing I have is this:


For once it was Dean, and not Sam, held at gun point, to encourage Sam to give up. I guess we should also count the fact that no one tied Sam to a chair.

Don’t forget to comment, or forget if you don’t care about this episode or this review. You may think I’m crazy spending this much time on an episode I didn’t like, for a show I’ve almost given up on. But my silly, most likely delusional, hope is that someone from the writers room might read this and decide not to bring back motel desk clerk #2 from episode 43.


Tessa

tessa-marlene.tumblr.com/
twitter.com/tessa_marlene 

76 comments:

  1. This was absolutely the most lackluster episode ever. First SPN I actually seriously thought about turning off in the middle, Secondary characters that I did not give a rats ass about being dropped as parellels into Sam and Deans relationship with the force of raining anvils. Truly this episode is either the "dumbing down" of fandom or lazy writing. your choice. I rate it a "2" for the 2 pairs of classy sunglasses.

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  2. I'm not looking forward to that musical episode either, with the way this story stole an entire episode away from Cas...

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  3. I love that you’ve inserted humour into your Gripe Review. I agree with most everything. At first I thought it was my birthday – what with the boys actually talking and all. But it was all so unsatisfactory, like they were tiptoeing around with words.

    LOL! I had the same reaction as you when Sam & Dean went into the bedroom with the newbie werewolves. The instruction was ‘kill them’ (or something like that, I wasn’t really paying attention)... so what exactly did they do while the two had their sisterly chitchat in the other room?... did they stand about glaring and growling at each other? Might’ve been more fun to watch than the ghastly blond acting in the living room.

    Honestly TPTB could write a very successful book on “How To Kill Anticipation & Momentum in a TV Series”.

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  4. I am sick of filler episodes where the "plot" happens to one-off characters acting as parallels to teach lessons to the brothers. Why not have the brothers, themselves, go through something that pushes them to do inhumane things for each other rather than through the who-gives-a-f**cks. Couldn't they have postponed the demon curing episode, just to expand on how far Sam has fallen for the sake of his brother, for instance? Instead of blowing that demon Dean story away entirely, in episode 3, have Sam kidnap some person, keep him in the bunker, and drain him of his blood to cure Dean as Sam walks back and forth between the room where he keeps the bloodbag and where Dean is kept. The juxtaposition of the two images would have been so powerful and demonstrative of their toxic relationship. Then you could spend the following episodes exploring the mental aftermath in reflection of the lives they have harmed, in contrast to what their family business has always been.

    And Castiel. Seriously if they spend another 20 minutes to provide exposition for what they have done behind the scenes while god-awful episodes like these were aired...You can't just expect us to be invested in what struggles he's going through if all we're getting is the cliff-notes versions, especially when his story (humanity vs heaven) has been done OVER and OVER again. Yes, he's chosen Dean over his allegiance to heaven, his life, and army before. What made him change his mind at this point that makes him have doubt? Why does he feel compelled to help out Heaven, when its denizens have all but hunted him and abandoned him for their own agenda as capriciously as the writers allow? Why does he love humanity so much? Why does he feel as if the Winchesters are his new family when they are treating him like crap, spending days LARPing and watching Game of Thrones while Cas is tortured and scavenging for food and shelter as a homeless man?

    Are any of the writers watching the show? Or are they all writing their own episodes independent of each other and giving zero f*cks about what the others do or a coherent overarching story line?

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  5. I wish we had seen more of Demon!Dean too. I've heard the theory that they didn't want Dean to be a demon for the 200th episode, so they cured him fast. However, Dean didn't do enough bad things to make me feel like he particularly needed to be cured. Yes he was a jerk, somewhat like Soulless!Sam (and don't get me started on the show deciding that having casual sex is a sign of being evil!); but all he did was kill demons, which they do anyway, sleep around, get into some fights, sing bad karaoke and hassle a stripper. Hassling a stripper was arguably the worst thing he did, because strippers have a right to set their limits. But really Dean never did anything he couldn't recover from.

    Which brings me to my big gripe, that if Dean does something questionable, the show thinks that they have to say that Sam has done something worse, because even as a demon, Dean must be better than Sam. Unfortunately, I don't CARE about Lester. He was told that he could sell his soul to kill his wife and instead of saying "are you nuts? All I want is a good divorce attorney?" he decides to sell his soul. And then he makes the fastest deal in history so Sam can be "responsible" for what happened to him.

    This episode was better than I expected, only because I was expecting Bitten levels of boredom and it didn't hit that. I don't know why they decided Kate was a good character to bring back. As you said it isn't like she was a vibrant character in a well loved episode. I'm somewhat afraid that she may be in line to be part of the spinoff they want to do. You know, the Incredible Hulk as Kate, wandering from town to town solving mysteries and trying to keep her wolfieness in check.

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  6. my Aunt Kate recently got a stunning green Mercedes-Benz S-Class Diesel just by some part time working online with a mac book air,work at any time any where, sundays are open too....http://tiny.cc/yfrnox

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  7. I'm with you on the conversations between the brothers. There was too much not said and what was spoken was so jumbled with what the other brother was not saying made the conversations confusing and difficult to watch. You'd think after 10 years of being on the road together they wouldn't be so hesitant to speak their minds and just have it out every now and then. How about they have a conversation that doesn't end with one of them storming out of the room and nothing be accomplished.

    I'm done with Sam storylines, we get it, he's all sulky and sad.

    And how about Castiel? Do they even care about what is going on with him?

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  8. I certainly didn’t need to see Sam go that far for Dean because I don’t think Sam and Dean’s relationship is so toxic that one of them would have to go insane.

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  9. Fantastic review, I completely agree. If I wasn't curious of how the brothers were doing getting back together, I wouldn't watch it either. Exactly like 'Sharp Teeth'. But alas, both were a waste of time.


    One thing I want to add is the horrible no-talent actor/actress they bring to the show and leave practically half of the episode on their shoulder. Those girls were terrible. Kate who was trying too hard to look scared all the time while being 'cute', and Tasha trying to act the stereotypical villain while she was also 'cute'!!! And I don't know what's with these cliche theatrical performances, jumping on the way and saying 'NO, she's my sister', or that demon Sam was torturing.

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  10. You make a number of points I agree with. I didn't mind revisiting Kate, and not killing her (which is how this paint by numbers plot normally goes). Normally the second appearance of any female character leads to their death (but sometimes just a near death experience and permanent exile). Cas's copilot might as well be wearing a countdown timer on her chest.

    I felt like the episode was proof positive that Cas was right ans they need time to recover. Like most active people, they got antsy just sitting around and proceed to get back to normal too soon and so performed poorly. The moments they were back closer to form were fairly obvious.

    Did I miss an episode where Garth died or something? I think you'll get your wish and we won't see Kate again, since they didn't point Kate toword Garth's group of "kosher" werewolves (perhaps too non-angst filled an ending for a CW show).

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  11. I perfer to think it was their experiment with writing a majority of the script with a computer program (or advanced word processor macro) with only a minimum of polishing done by a human.

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  12. "Which brings me to my big gripe, that if Dean does something questionable, the show thinks that they have to say that Sam has done something worse, because even as a demon, Dean must be better than Sam."
    I don't see that at all. I remember when Sam used an unstable hunter and then dumped him in a vamp nest, stole his car, all leading to the death of the hunter and violating the unspoken, 'No man left behind' hunter rule and Dean was brother that did that terrible texting thing.
    In this case, the writers set both brothers up as monsters and ask the audience to judge which one was the worse monster. My gripe with that is not which brother is better or worse than the other; it's that hunting...the very basic 'quest' or journey these heroes supposedly undertake season after season...is shown to be an occupation not worthy of a hero quest; it is a quest for losers, because all it ever gets the Winchesters is loss, misery, humiliation, turns them into morally questionable people who end up acting like two teenage girls on their cycle. I really don't want to watch a season of girly men angsting and emoting their way through an entire season again.

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  13. My husband also mentioned the lack of Sam's chair-fu.

    Did you get the idea that Dean did NOT move in for the kill with stupid werewolf #2 because he was suddenly cognizant that he had an issue with the MOC? Now if Dean is afraid of dying because he believes he may come back as a demon, where does that leave Hunting as part of the show? Or if Dean is afraid of killing because the MOC may overpower him (I gathered from various interviews over last season that the MOC was was like steroids, and Dean was getting both more powerful AND more road-ragey) and turn him into a killer.

    He didn't need the First Blade to hook into the MOC to turn into the dude who could overpower a VAMPIRE (and we have no idea how old/strong hillbilly blood-sucker was in A4) because he got the First Blade later; so that was ALL Mark of Cain in the script in A4 (I canNOT for the life of me remember non-turned vampire chick's names); conversely, he was really truly nutzoid when he tried to kill Gadreel at the end of Stairway for Heaven (and insisted on bringing First Blade to the angel confab).

    BUT I must say I liked this episode more than you did. My husband told me he never wants to watch another episode of "one guy yells at the other guy" and it filled that requirement. I told my husband I never want to watch another episode with Sam's chair-fu featured until I have been drinking heavily. This episode fulfilled both.

    And I liked very much the discussions the two brothers had at the lake and in the car. I liked that while Sam was upset about Dean lying to Kate, that he backed Dean's play to get to Tasha (and maybe Kate, if she went along with her sister's murderous qualities). I even liked how Tasha played it that eating humans was GOOD and FUN; I realized Kate had never tasted human flesh (if we believe the character about what she'd been doing the last two years) and could not relate to Tasha's hunger..

    I was ready for a MOTW episode and I got it. I think the trouble Dean is in for the duration is going to be a slow reveal and I am all for that.

    Thank you for your long review here. It helped me order my own thoughts about what I liked and disliked about the episode.

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  14. When I knew this episode was coming up, I imagined a plot that had Sam and Dean bringing Kate to Garth's Little Acre in Wisconsin (?) and then getting Garth stuck in a triangle with Kate and his MEGA forgettable blond wife. Garth as new agey werewolf chick magnet. Sorry the show didn't go there, but then DJ Qualls has his own show on SciFi now.

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  15. But, but, but, but Sam is like, like, like the quintessential CW character, even more so than Dean. Lately he's so broody and whiney and emo it is doubtful you could improve his mood by even literally blowing sunshine up his butt.

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  16. I'm fairly sure the idea was that Dean hasn't been killing free long enough for them not to be nervous that the mark might not take him over again.

    This isn't like Sam's demon blood addiction. Short of him becoming the new Bobby, Dean just doing "the work" is going to periodically push him near that line until the mark is dealt with.

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  17. There is so much that I agree with here I don't know where to start. Was the actress who played Kate hired solely because she can make her eyes bigger at will? Like she is some sort of weird real life anime character wanting to emotionally manipulate us at a set 'dramatic' point. Considering the jokes about Dean and his interest in anime part of me did wonder if the big eyes was causing him not to kill her because his down stairs brain was taking over after she fluttered her huge eyelids at him after confessing her sorry tale.

    Also I get the brothers are 'guys' but so agree with you about their talk - cut the ambiguity, the angst, the melodrama. I just watched Doctor Who - two scenes, two sodding scenes was all it took. One with the angst/pain/betrayal and the next the recrimination and then the reason for fixing the relationship was all it took. And it is for kids! Two sodding scenes, please why can't supernatural be the same? Oh yeah Steven Moffat, lot better writer than Glass.

    Plus I wish they just admit they are about to do the switcheroo - we haven't had what is wrong with Sam for five minutes, it is due back. The dilemma now is it going to be the thing with Lester is either bother him way too much or not enough. I would have preferred Demon Dean but seeing how we aren't getting that just get it over with. Oh yeah not being cynical at all here. ;)

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  18. Bertha Strongham1 November 2014 at 22:55

    This epi, was seriously ho hum for me. Too much introspection by all characters!

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  19. I am not either. After seeing the pre-pubescent teens in the SPN Special and now a bunch of what looks like middle school girls living their lives through the Winchester story, I'm thinking this is what the writers think of the fans and it offends me.

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  20. I agree with you. Those who are liking this one, can't figure out why.

    The writers are now writing for themselves and no-one else and they are getting paid for it that is what gets me. Have seen better fanfics out there with similar subject matter than this one. Plus, I understand the injury was real so they had no choice but to put Sam in a sling, but honestly they have had injured hunters pass stuff onto others before and seen what happens when they hunt (Travis and the Ruguru) so instead of the whole 'Dean, you're not ready!' turning into the back and forth of who is ready less, wouldn't sane Sam just say 'My arm is out of commission man, can't we sit it out till my arm is better? Though according to Glass, MoC Dean into a damsel in distress and injured Sam able to stab two newbie werewolves so save both brothers.

    Two handed Sam is captured/injured/knocked out as a rule, but one armed he is better than Dean So is the 200th episode going to involve chopping off Sam's arm, as it is obviously hindering him according to Glass.

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  21. So dropping her off at a house and us getting Mormon werewolves to come out to greet her, while the hunters didn't intrude on a werewolf moment wasn't possible? They could have implied Garth was there but not shown a face or not had Garth there at all.


    Actually we didn't need for Garth to be seen. All it would have taken would have been a mention of sending Kate and her sister to Garth could have at least been mentioned as an option other than killing them when Dean asked for another option but Kate ran before they could have taken her there after her sister's death.

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  22. Hi Tessa,


    I didn't want to tune into this episode, as I had a feeling about the fourth episode of the series being a poor one, and I'm usually right. I liked Kate and I was surprised that the boys let her go in 'Bitten' since she had killed her flat mate. I feel sure I've seen this actress some where before but can't place her. I did originally rate this episode at 8.5 and after reading threads on IMDb found a negative response to it and after re-watching again I degraded it and gave it 7.5. I was surprised that Sam and Dean were BOTH over come by four werewolves since they are seasoned hunters at one time they would have cleaned the floor with them. Are the writers making Sam and Dean look weak?


    I did like Kate's story but did find it over powered the leads. Reminding me of Charlies progression and her foreseeable return shortly. Sigh!! *** I was disappointed in the brothers talk as I felt what Sam did was the topic of conversation and over powered Demon Dean. Dean didn't reveal anything about his time but laid it on thick towards Sam over Lester, which I think was a bit uncalled for. Sam was showing real concern towards Dean asking if he was okay. Dean said thank you for saving him which I loved. At least Dean showed he cared and Sam's efforts were noted of course until we get to his dark side tendencies. What did Sam really do whilst Dean was a demon and away from home? What terrible things has Sam done in order to be questioned. He does the good deed in saving Dean then he seems to get bombarded by Dean's sharp tongue. Sometimes I feel its Sam that is written as the Monster and not Dean whom clearly was turned into the Monster and is questioning what Sam did or did not do?


    Love Bella xxx

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  23. At first I thought it was my birthday – what with the boys actually talking and all. But it was all so unsatisfactory, like they were tiptoeing around with words.I guess getting deeper into the mythology stuff and what's happening right now with the brothers is too much for Glass, so he fell back on familiar territories: Sam having darkness inside (because *gasp* he used a dick bag who wanted to murder his wife to achieve his goal,) and Dean's self loathing.

    The instruction was ‘kill them’ (or something like that, I wasn’t really paying attention)... so what exactly did they do while the two had their sisterly chitchat in the other room?I was thinking the same thing. Kept picturing the four of them standing outside the door counting 'One Mississippi,Two Mississippi,...'

    Honestly TPTB could write a very successful book on “How To Kill Anticipation & Momentum in a TV Series”. Five seasons in a row, that's got to be a record.

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  24. I am sick of filler episodes where the "plot" happens to one-off characters acting as parallels to teach lessons to the brothers.I'm even failing to see what the lesson is here. That you shouldn't hesitate to off your loved ones if they go bad? Don't Sam and Dean have a masters degree in that one already?Couldn't they have postponed the demon curing episode, just to expand on how far Sam has fallen for the sake of his brother, for instance?I could publish a book of all the excellent ideas fans had for how Demon Dean should play out. Instead we got medical procedures and super hugs after 3 measly episodes.You can't just expect us to be invested in what struggles he's going through if all we're getting is the cliff-notes versions, especially when his story (humanity vs heaven) has been done OVER and OVER again.They expect us to be invested in the story of a girl we only saw in one awful episode with shaky camera work, so much that they gave her another encore. 20 minutes of exposition for one of the recurring characters they supposedly keep around just for the fans is too much in their eyes.

    As for abandoned Castiel questions, I'm still waiting for them to explain how he kept coming back all those times he was blown to smithereens.Why does he feel as if the Winchesters are his new family when they are treating him like crap, spending days LARPing and watching Game of Thrones while Cas is tortured and scavenging for food and shelter as a homeless man?Don't get me even started on that crap Dean pulled in season 8, don't... I can't get angry and become a green monster again like I did when that was shoved in the script.Are any of the writers watching the show? Or are they all writing their own episodes independent of each other and giving zero f*cks about what the others do or a coherent overarching story line?My feeling is they don't care about the legacy of the show or the feelings of fans. All they want is to have fun and feel important that they control such beloved characters. You know my stance about these crop of writers and I'm still firm on it despite the criticism I received when I first said it: If it were up to me I'd fire them all (except Dabb.)

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  25. I've heard the theory that they didn't want Dean to be a demon for the 200th episode, so they cured him fast.Interesting theory and possibly the only explanation for why they did this. Except I fail to see how a filler episode about high school musicals is in any way better than an episode with demon Dean.Dean didn't do enough bad things to make me feel like he particularly needed to be cured.Exactly my thoughts in one of my previous reviews. I said I didn't understand the urgency of curing demon Dean when all he did was singing bad karaoke and sleeping with random, willing women.If Dean does something questionable, the show thinks that they have to say that Sam has done something worse, because even as a demon, Dean must be better than Sam. That's my big gripe too. Sam had his share of running against the moral compass in seasons 4, 5, 6, and 7. Even before that, in seasons 1-3 they relied on the darkness in him and him and his destiny as YED's special boy and Lucifer's vessel. I thought it was his turn to hold the compass and guide Dean to the light. But no, the show runner and writers seem to be stuck on the same train tracks for eternity where Sam is bad/wrong/in trouble and Dean has to save him/set him right.I'm somewhat afraid that she may be in line to be part of the spinoff they want to do.Which will fail as miserably as Bloodlines did, so they better not waste their time.

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  26. Fantastic reviewThank you, glad you enjoyed.

    One thing I want to add is the horrible no-talent actor/actress they bring to the show and leave practically half of the episode on their shoulder.Can't really blame the actors (though I agree they were terrible,) when they are given dialogue as bad as, the examples you gave and most likely 5 pages of exposition monologue.

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  27. Normally the second appearance of any female character leads to their deathOnly if that female character is liked by the fans it seems, like Sarah and Tessa. I wouldn't have batted an eye if they killed Kate. Halfway through her monologue I was wishing for it.they got antsy just sitting around and proceed to get back to normal too soon and so performed poorly.Are you talking about the writer, or Sam and Dean? CauseI didn't see Sam and Dean do anything this episode other than react to other characters and their lame stories.I think you'll get your wish and we won't see Kate again, since they didn't point Kate toword Garth's group of "kosher" werewolves (perhaps too non-angst filled an ending for a CW show).Hope you're right. However if they still wanted to do that nothing would stop them. They just have to insert a scene at the beginning with Garth calling the boys, them arriving at kosher farm and voila, there's Kate. (If any SPN writers are reading this, please don't!)

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  28. Did you get the idea that Dean did NOT move in for the kill with stupid werewolf #2 because he was suddenly cognizant that he had an issue with the MOC?Not really. In fact I felt the MoC was as absent and non-existent in this episode as Castiel.

    My husband told me he never wants to watch another episode of "one guy yells at the other guy" and it filled that requirement.I don't want to watch that too. But I happen to believe hat there are better ways to fulfill that wish.

    I liked that while Sam was upset about Dean lying to Kate, that he backed Dean's play to get to Tasha (and maybe Kate, if she went along with her sister's murderous qualities).See that's my problem. I don't care about Kate enough to sit through a Sam and Dean dialogue focused on her when there are a million more important things they could talk about. FFS, they still haven't had a decent discussion about Castiel and dude drove what looked like 200 miles to give Dean a hug and save him.

    I was ready for a MOTW episode and I got it.Like I said, my problem isn't the MotW episodes themselves, but the absolute abysmal quality of them and the fact that recently, Sam and Dean are treated like tourists in most of them.

    Thank you for your long review here. It helped me order my own thoughts about what I liked and disliked about the episode.You're welcome. If you like this type of review come back often. I post a Gripe Review for every episode of Supernatural, rain or shine. :)

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  29. Considering the jokes about Dean and his interest in anime part of me did wonder if the big eyes was causing him not to kill her because his down stairs brain was taking over after she fluttered her huge eyelids at him after confessing her sorry tale.Interesting theory. Doubt they are clever enough to go to that layer otherwise they would have hinted at it.

    I get the brothers are 'guys' but so agree with you about their talk - cut the ambiguity, the angst, the melodrama.May guys have meaningful talks in other shows that are shorter but loaded with impact and depth. Doctor Who is a good example, so are Hannibal, Breaking Bad and The Walking Death. There are shows that can pull off vague and evasive (like True Detective) but that requires genius levels of writing these guys simply don't have.

    I wish they just admit they are about to do the switcheroo - we haven't had what is wrong with Sam for five minutes, it is due back.I don't think they are at all shy about it. Demon Dean is barely out the door they are dropping hints that what Sam did was 10 times worse than what Dean did while cruising with the king of hell. In fact, much like the time Dean came back from Purgatory brimming with untold stories, we got more info about what Sam was doing than whatever in the world, other than drinking and singing, Dean was doing.

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  30. I couldn't buy that Sam would use his arm as a reason not to hunt, considering he was more than capable when tracking Dean and dealing with demons.

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  31. I must be in the minority here but I felt like the episode was at least solid. Certainly not perfect but I've seen worse from these writers. There wasn't anything I downright hated. Some of the brother bickering was a bit much but I did like some of the bonding scenes and much needed talk between them.

    The main plot was relatively throwaway but like I said, I've seen worse. I'd give it 7/10 probably.

    The problem Tessa is that the show isn't going to get any better. I've accepted that by the end of season 9. It's certainly still watchable and even enjoyable but it's a show where you have to take the good with the bad.

    Since the show usually has a variety of episodes from scary to funny to whatever, I think we tend to get some good episodes and some bad ones. I'm enjoying the show enough to keep watching. I wish it was Kripke quality but I've accepted that the budget is vastly lower and Kripke has moved on. Still enjoying it though and there isn't a whole lot of shows like this left on tv anymore.

    I'm enjoying Constantine (most hate it) but the ratings are really bad and the show will likely be canned soon which is a damn shame in my opinion.

    Anyways I do agree with some of your words Tessa. So I hope nothing here is taken offensively or anything. More or less I enjoyed the episode but it won't go down as a classic.

    Looking forward to the 200th a lot though in hopes that it will be classic material. :)

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  32. I was thinking more like a throwaway line telling fans "okay her story is over, you won't be seeing her again but we aren't killing her off."

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  33. To be fair, everyone on the production was saying that Dean would be cured by episode 3. The whole "Year of the Deanmon" was the CW marketing, not the actual show. Considering Glass didn't create the characters of Garth or Kate, he gets no residuals for writing those characters.

    Regarding your Garth criticism, being a bit uncoordinated doesn't preclude a person from being knowledgeable. He may not be the ultimate hunter, doesn't mean he can't know shit.

    Also, Charlie didn't fix the Bunker computer. She, through a bunch wire fiddling transferred the info on the computer to a tablet. I don't know enough about computers to say that it;s possible to transfer software from an old computer like that to a new one. And in an episode with flying monkeys, it's not something I'm really going to care about. So taking a few hunting cases and surviving means she's on the level of the Winchesters? Okay.


    You ever think that is the point? That may not be emotionally ready just yet? That's just nitpicking for the sake of nitpicking.

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  34. Don't forget the writers killed off Ellen and Jo Harvelle, Pamela Barnes (the medium whose eyes got burned out seeing Cas's true form) and Meg too. I'm a little nervous that they might kill off Dorothy or Charlie next time they show up.

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  35. Am I talking about talking about the writers, or Sam and Dean? The simplest answer would be "Yes." If it were just the writers fear of boredom, then the story would have followed the Busman's Holiday or Mystery Magnet trope (see http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BusmansHoliday or http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MysteryMagnet ) where they would try to honestly take time off and the supernatural would find them.

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  36. I could depending on how they brought it up. They could have had Sam stalling for more rest time for Dean by pointing to his arm every time Dean goes lets get out there. Or simply pointing out considering we have seen them badly injured before and then suddenly on their feet and Sam has had that sling on for four episodes that running about and hunting is causing it to take longer to heal or is worried about it not healing correctly, which it would. Sure he did it while looking for Dean but that is his brother and most of the time he was looking he looked awful.


    It would have been a nice discussion Sam saying that. It would also show us them both as professional equals - you don't have police on the street with gammy arms, so why would a hunter who faces violence and danger, if he didn't have to? It would also give us the feeling that he is willing to go that extra mile for his family but not going to put him and Dean at risk for a possible monster they haven't confirmed when they can put someone else on the job.


    If the point was that Sam going along because he wasn't sure Dean would have gone alone and he didn't want to it failed for me. Maybe that is because I remember the days of the first season where Dean asked Sam if he was sleeping and it wasn't only just concern he also added that he needed to know as Sam needed to be at the top of his game because he was watching Dean's back. But guess that is long gone.

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  37. This review was far more entertaining than the actual episode. So there's at least that.

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  38. You obviously miss the point I was making; which is that when these writers write episodes specifically for the purpose of whatever character they want to bring back, the Winchesters become guest stars in their own show.
    Our first introduction to Garth was Bobby asking why he was still alive, and the next two appearances (if I remember right) he was knocked out, wondering what he missed. The point is that those kinds of characters, written to be 'fun' can, with the stroke of a pen, be elevated to whatever the writers want. It is much easier to write for them, because the writers don't have to pay attention to the things that I mentioned; characterization, past canon, and such. They can become insta-anything.
    I am no computer programmer expert either, but I am pretty sure that a computer than runs by magic has no wires to hook up. I'm pretty sure that a computer built in the 1940s ran on DOS, or some other earlier computer language, and I am pretty sure that it would not be compatible with the Windows operating system....unless you are Charlie Bradbury, the smartest person on the planet.
    I don't think it takes too much to nitpick what these writers produce, because it is pretty obvious that they don't care. They are just having fun, writing for themselves, and have no interest in protecting the franchise or the characters they were handed, since they have managed to diminish the idea of hunting as a noble venture, the Winchester characters, as well as the angels and demons. That is a pretty broad stroke.
    Not emotionally ready? I get that, but why are they not emotionally ready and why? Are they not ready to hunt in general? Hunt together? Trust the other? Trust themselves individually? Are they just physically tired? This episode did not make the problem clear. Is being turned into a demon worse than spending time in Hell? In Purgatory? Is Dean just embarrassed or is his problem what Sam did to save him is eating at Dean, because he doesn't feel his life is worth whatever it is that Sam did? Why is Sam not ready? Is what he did eating at him, or is he worried that Dean might go on a slaughtering spree to feed the Mark? As far as I know, Sam doesn't even know that the Mark requires killing. Crowley told the audience that, but Sam hasn't even researched the damned thing, and Cas (an angel) seems to know very little about it.
    No, I am not being nitpicky. I want to know what the Winchester story is. I don't want to have guess at what it may or may not be. As a viewer, I don't think that is asking too much.

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  39. Adam Glass truly loves Supernatural. I'll give him that. But he does not know Supernatural. He knows the history but he just does not have enough heart or depth to tell the stories he wants to. He thinks he does, but this episode proves that once again,he just doesn't. I have so much on my mind for this one.

    1) I thought for a few moments, it was really good. I felt like it was an old school episode. It was going to have heart. Then it failed me.

    2) I didn't even remember Kate. If you're going to make us feel, bring back a character we cared about or remembered. There are dozens. From the first few seasons. Kate was one of AG's characters so evidently, he thought we'd care to see her again.No.

    3) I didn't hate it or love it. It made me feel bleh, blah, whatever.

    4) The only thing that made me smile was -

    “Maybe I’m not ready to hunt. But I am just trying to do the right thing, man. Cuz I’m so sick and tired of doing the wrong one.”-Dean to Sam

    And it wasn't the dialogue that made me smile, it was Jensen. Not Dean. Not Sam.

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  40. Great review, Tess! I agree w/many of your gripes. But I need to gripe about Kate, specifically.

    Kate: Kate has to be one of the most despicable characters in Supernatural history, IMO. Why you ask? She has condemned her parents(and extended family) to a lifetime of pain and unanswered questions. Because of her actions, her parents will NEVER know what happened to their daughters! They didn't just inexplicably lose ONE daughter; they lost BOTH all b/c Kate was lonely or something. Why would the writers think that was a good thing for Kate. As a character, she fared much better in "Bitten," IMO, than in this crappy episode.

    Nothing about Kate's characterization was consistent. She loves her family and is really close to them, but she disappears w/o a word. Okay. She is especially close to her sister, but never writes or calls. Why in the world did she disappear for months without a word to them?!?!? She could e-mail with her family w/o putting them in harm’s way. She could be in the peace corp or studying abroad. I'm not sure why she had to disappear completely. She hears her sister is dying, and what does she do? She condemns her sister to a horrific existence as a bloodthirsty monster and then kills her b/c she didn't
    adapt as well as Kate! What a shocker, Kate! Maybe you should have said your good-byes to Tasha and let her die as a human. Kate is all-around a horrible person, and despite the parallels, she is NOTHING like Sam or Dean. I hope we never see her again.

    Sam/Dean: I found all their interactions to be "off." What were all those conversations about. Dean’s last line literally had me thinking, “What are you talking about, Dean?” All of Dean’s angst, guilt, or embarrassment was unearned just like Sam’s desperation to save Dean was unearned. It really goes back to my chief complaint this year: the DD arc was too short and too tame. What is Dean feeling so guilty/embarrassed about? What did he do as a demon that was so awful? I saw nothing. Drinking,
    watching porn, singing, killing other demons, hanging with Crowley? What? Those things aren’t so awful that Dean should be wracked w/guilt or self-loathing. Trying to kill Sam? That’s not the first time a
    supernaturally influfenced Dean tried to kill Sam so Dean shouldn’t be upset about that either. Lester? That guy was a douche who put out a contract on his wife? Dean shouldn’t be losing sleep or needing rest b/c of that. All the "are you ready" stuff had me thinking, "What are they talking about? Ready for what? What's the problem?"

    If they had actually taken some chances with DD and allowed him to wreak some havoc and cause some trouble then I would understand Dean’sstate of mind in this episode, but that didn’t happen. DD didn’t ever go completely overboard so I saw no reason for his guilt/embarrassment. It was just weird given what little DD actually did.

    Sam: Sadly, I think we will learn that Sam either tortured or killed more HUMANS in his quest to find Dean. The way Jared played that scene, I thought Sam was lying. He clearly did more monstrous things, which will play right into Carver’s whole “who was the real monster” theme! Ugh . . . . I’m not looking forward to Sam being thrown under the bus AGAIN, but I’ve become used to it under this regime.

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  41. Sam: Sadly, I think we will learn that Sam either tortured or killed more HUMANS in his quest to find Dean. The way Jared played that scene, I thought Sam was lying. He clearly did more monstrous things, which will play right into Carver’s whole “who was the real monster” theme! Ugh . . . . I’m not looking forward to Sam being thrown under the bus AGAIN, but I’ve become used to it under this regime.

    As much as I like the “There's nothing I wouldn't do for you” sentiment, consciously harming innocents would go against who Sam is even though he would be trying to find Dean. It would also end the show because the brothers being stronger together wouldn’t really be true anymore. Going their separate ways would be for the best. It would mean Dean trying to find happiness elsewhere because Sam would have found out that he lets Dean down no matter what path he tries to take.

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  42. I guess I just put nothing past Carver. I don't trust him w/the show or the characters, esp. Sam who he has screwed over in some way since his return.

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  43. I completely agree w/you and made the same point on another forum. Sam using his messed up arm as an excuse to stay out of the hunt would have made more sense than the repeated insistence that Dean "wasn't ready" whatever that meant!

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  44. If they’ll show that Sam did depraved things to find Dean, the only solution would be for Sam to decide that he isn’t going to drag them down anymore, that Dean deserves to be happy and he’ll never be truly happy with Sam. So Sam and Dean would have to go their separate ways. That might work for shows like Nip/Tuck but it’s far from what Kripke envisioned Supernatural to be. It’s supposed to be a show about the two brothers, the lengths they would go for each other but not in a monstrous way.

    Maybe Carver has a different take on what being a monster means.

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  45. I really liked Bitten. We had scores of episodes of the boys doing their thing. It was refreshing to see them work a case from another perspective, and see how the Winchesters are perceived by the people involved in the case/people who can over hear their very public supernatural conversations.

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  46. Well, thank you for finding what I have to say worthwhile. I usually get lambasted as being a show 'hater.'

    Just wanted to say that I couldn't agree more that this stable of writers, Carver included, doesn't have a clue who the Sam and Dean Winchesters are. I have said they have turned them into 'cardboard' cutouts.

    In Bad Boys; which was a sweet episode, but Glass used his own childhood experiences (I assume, or what he wished they would have been); not to illuminate Dean's character, but purely for the sake of autobiographical
    pimping, and overlaid that onto a character whose background and upbringing is the complete opposite and called it a 'love letter' to Dean. Talk about playing with something that was never yours!

    I have long given up on Sam, because the writers have lost his character completely, changing him year after year into whatever they want him to be. I also completely agree with you that Dean, too, has disappeared, and the only part of the original character we see is what JA manages to put into his performances, despite the crap they are giving him to do.

    If these writers understood anything at all about human motivations, I feel they would realize that Dean's one big motivating factor is that he has never come to terms with getting off the rack and torturing souls...and liking it. If I thought for a minute that the show was going to address that issue this year (his 'always doing wrong statement), I would be excited, but they won't.

    As far as Glass in this episode, he picked a bad character to bring back up, he had no idea what he was trying to say, created 40 minutes of filler and compounded that all by inserting conversations (angst, as you say) between Sam and Dean about what they did or didn't do in the last few weeks without either of them (1) admitting to anything, painful or otherwise, (2) either character recognizing the need for forgiveness or atonement, and (3) creating a set-up or possible resolution wherein trust could be found in themselves or in each other, if that was the need.

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  47. I was disappointed in the brothers talk as I felt what Sam did was the topic of conversation and over powered Demon DeanIt's like they are alergic to letting Dean have the spotlight. We get a cliffhanger and three episodes of Dean hanging out with Crowley at bars and it's back to, "But ohhhh! Look what Sam did!" Reminds me of the begining of season 8 when Dean had just came back from Purgatory yet most of the flashbacks and show's story were about Samelia. What terrible things has Sam done in order to be questioned. Nothing. He taught a pathetic scumbag who had murderous intentions toward his wife how to sell his soul to achieve that goal. Oh, the atrocity.

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  48. The problem Tessa is that the show isn't going to get any better. I've accepted that by the end of season 9. It's certainly still watchable and even enjoyable but it's a show where you have to take the good with the bad. I used to say a thing like that about an episode like Swap Meat, and yet that episode was miles better than Paper Moon. At the very least it had humor. The issue isn't that I want the show to be perfect. It's that now Reichenbach is our On The Head of The Pin and Paper Moon is the bottom.I wish it was Kripke quality but I've accepted that the budget is vastly lower and Kripke has moved on.But this isn't a budget problem. I have no issue with them not showing explosions and high speed car chaces. This is writing. Pretty much the cheapest part of making a TV show yet it's were SPN has been f*cking it up since 2011.I'm enjoying Constantine (most hate it) but the ratings are really bad and the show will likely be canned soon which is a damn shame in my opinion.The jury is still out for me on that one since only two episodes have aired. But Constantine had its share of problems in the first episode, namely frontloading too much of the backstory before people had a chance to know any of the characters. I joke though, that Constantine acts the way Castiel should act after all the sh!t he's gotten from Sam and Dean (and Crowley, Meg, Naomi, Metatron and now Hannah.)

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  49. Thank you. I post one of these after every episode, especially after silly ones. Come back as often as you like and have a laugh with us. It's the best way to not get too wound up about the show's flaws.

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  50. Adam Glass truly loves Supernatural. I'll give him that. But he does not know Supernatural.I seriously judge his writing abilities after seeing the collection of his episodes. He does everythings they tell you not to do in writing class. I don't want to question how he got the job cause I genuinly like the guy. But I wished I could have a chat with him and see where his bad writing practices stem from.From the first few seasons. Kate was one of AG's characters so evidently, he thought we'd care to see her again.No.This is the fad I'm talking about. I'm willing to bet he posed a question on his twitter, "Who wants to see what happened to Kate?" He did it for his other darling creation Krissy. Once he got a few yeays, most likely from fans who like to suck up to him so he puts more bro moments, or DeanCas or whatever in his writing, he took it as his confirmation and ran with it. That's the story I've made in my head at least.

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  51. I have no problem with that idea if it's interesting, multilayered characters played by talented actors in original stories. What I have problems with are bland, one note character, played by inexperienced actors suddenly charged with carrying entire episodes on their shoulders, in stories I've seen a dozen times in different iterations of the same formula before.

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  52. She has condemned her parents(and extended family) to a lifetime of pain and unanswered questions. Because of her actions, her parents will NEVER know what happened to their daughters! They didn't just inexplicably lose ONE daughter; they lost BOTH all b/c Kate was lonely or something.True. But judging by the lovely flashback they showed us the family didn't seem too upset about their missing daughter, the way they sat at their table and giggled over dinner. They may not be that disturbed.

    Nothing about Kate's characterization was consistent.Characterization doesn't seem to be a priority on this show. Characters come and go with minimal personalities and motives just to fill in a blank in the plot that needs to get from point A to B.

    Sam/Dean: I found all their interactions to be "off." What were all those conversations about. Dean’s last line literally had me thinking, “What are you talking about, Dean?”Me too. What did he mean by "the wrong thing?" What did he do wrong? Kill Abaddon? Fight Metatron? Slept with a woman and didn't call? Kill a bunch of demons in self defense? Kill a jackass who made a deal with the devil to murder his wife? It's like Glass is writing one story and pulling dialogue from another story. Or do they think whatever-I-do-is-wrong is Dean's default state?

    the DD arc was too short and too tame.It's what I said in my first review this season. They made us think the Mark made Dean this powerful, dangerous creature, when in reality it just made him a douchier version of himself.

    All the "are you ready" stuff had me thinking, "What are they talking about? Ready for what? What's the problem?"Same here, hence the gripe. I know a lot of people dig the Samn'Dean talks, and drink them up like fine wine. That's our problem. The writers think Sam and Dean could say anything. As long as they are in the Impala and it's night and a gloomy light is cast over them, and they look pensive and tormented and stuff, we'd eat it up. I'm waiting for the day they have them recite the periodic table and people lament over the angst they projected in their scenes.

    If they had actually taken some chances with DD and allowed him to wreak some havoc and cause some trouble then I would understand Dean’sstate of mind in this episode, but that didn’t happen. They seem to have a universal issue with those kinds of stories. Wasn't it a similar case with Godstiel? Before he committed the massacre at the campaign office all he did was cure babies and blind people, tell off a homophobic priest, wreck the KKK headquarters and turn the image of Jesus into an image of himself. None of it merited the stress and emergency Sam and Dean felt to find him and stop him.

    I’m not looking forward to Sam being thrown under the bus AGAIN, but I’ve become used to it under this regime.I hope to God they don't go down that path again. If they do my theory about how they handle Sam will be proven. The suspicion I have that they have a finite number of ideas for Sam that they cycle through: he's either the chosen one, or the cursed one, or the sick one, or the monster. Lather, rinse, repeat.


    Thanks for the awesome comment.

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  53. Carver screwed this up last season when he had Dean do highly questionable things just to keep Ezekiel/Gadreel happy. I said it then too that this wasn't ok. That even in his most desperate moment, when the life of his brother was in line (like when Uriel threatened Sam to get him to give up Anna) he didn't cross that line, which made him a hero we looked up to. If they do the same thing with Sam I'll lose all hope in them ever getting the essence of the brotherly bond right. They'd F it up for good.

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  54. Yeah, except Kate wasn't created by him, Robbie Thompson wrote "Bitten."

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  55. Yeah, god forbid he try to create a recurring female character. The nerve of the guy. It's not like the writers get misogynist for the lack of female characters, how dare he attempt to fix that.

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  56. Kate is not a character. She doesn't have enough dimension to be called a character. She is just a mouth piece for exposition and a vehicle to move the predictable script. Doesn't matter if it's a male, a female or a sentient object. In order to create a character one has to give them feelings, motives, goals, values, direction, weaknesses, internal knots, attachments and resentments. Kate never had any, not in Bitten and certainly not here were the script only required her to recite the plot and the actress only gave her one expression (check out the two screen shots of her in the article.)

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  57. It seems that they tried to downplay that aspect of it. Dean and Cas’ conversation at the end of episode 9.03 I'm No Angel wasn’t shown in its entirety and Cas never seemed particularly mad even though Dean had told him to leave.

    But Sam’s actions wouldn’t be hand-waved in the narrative. There would be flashbacks, Dean questioning Sam’s morals and ethics and the powers that be encouraging the audience to ask themselves “Who is the true monster?” There would be no escaping from the implication that the brothers remaining together causes only pain.

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  58. It was AG. He tweeted about it before it got approved and how excited he was when they started planning the story board. RT created her but he and AG are about the same when it comes to SPN. They love the show but they write like fanboy's and not objective writers who love their creation.

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  59. I'm in the minority because I actually liked this episode. Yes, it was filler and I didn't really care all that much about Kate (hated Bitten with a passion). So her part of this story was blah. But I liked the rest of it. In fact, I even liked it a little more after watching it a second time.

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  60. True. But judging by the flashback the family didn't seem too broken up
    about their missing daughter, the way they sat around table laughing and
    having a jolly time.

    I would have to watch the episode again (not likely to happen - haha), but I thought that was that scene was showing Kate returning to her home from college or it was the night she disappeared. I didn't get the sense that that scene of them at dinner was when Kate had "disappeared."

    What did he mean by "the wrong thing?" What did he do wrong? Kill
    Abaddon? Fight Metatron? Sleep with a woman and not call? Kill a bunch
    of demons in self defense? Kill a jackass who made a deal with the devil
    to murder his wife?

    I have no clue. Maybe he was referencing taking on the MOC in the first place, but if that was the case, the writers should have just had him say that. Why talk around it? Honestly, I doubt the writers know why Dean is upset. They just know he is in an angsty mood so each writer will put his/her spin on that angst. The same crap happened w/Sam last year.

    The writers think Sam and Dean could say anything. As long as they are
    in the Impala and it's night with a gloomy light is cast over them, and
    they look pensive and tormented, we'd eat it up.

    I hear you, but given how many loved this episode b/c of the brotherly talk, I guess the writers are right. I need more than Sam and Dean in the same room chatting. I need a conversation that makes sense and is clear!

    And I hope Sam isn't made out to be the "monster" (yet again) this year, but I put nothing past Carver.

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  61. My pet theory is that the writers were so blindly in love with their idea for the craptastic 200th episode, that they just *had to* cure Dean and write this filler episode to accommodate it.

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  62. I thought Bitten was an original story with interesting multilayered characters (can't speak to the talent of the actors),

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  63. I would argue that young fanfiction writers prefer to write about "Mary Sues". They are not too complicated characters, they are often the same age as the writers, and they are already somehow associated to their favorite characters (Sam,Dean). I think Kate is a Mary Sue.

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  64. Except, Mary Sues are supposedly idealized characters. Kate hardly qualifies by any standard.

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  65. I think she qualifies as 'idealized' character in this fandom.

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  66. Kate: Kate has to be one of the most despicable characters in
    Supernatural history, IMO. Why you ask? She has condemned her
    parents(and extended family) to a lifetime of pain and unanswered
    questions. Because of her actions, her parents will NEVER know what
    happened to their daughters! They didn't just inexplicably lose ONE
    daughter; they lost BOTH all b/c Kate was lonely or something. Why would
    the writers think that was a good thing for Kate. As a character, she
    fared much better in "Bitten," IMO, than in this crappy episode.

    Nothing
    about Kate's characterization was consistent. She loves her family and
    is really close to them, but she disappears w/o a word. Okay. She is
    especially close to her sister, but never writes or calls. Why in the
    world did she disappear for months without a word to them?!?!? She could
    e-mail with her family w/o putting them in harm’s way. She could be
    in the peace corp or studying abroad. I'm not sure why she had to
    disappear completely. She hears her sister is dying, and what does she
    do? She condemns her sister to a horrific existence as a bloodthirsty
    monster and then kills her b/c she didn't adapt as well as Kate! What a
    shocker, Kate! Maybe you should have said your good-byes to Tasha and
    let her die as a human. Kate is all-around a horrible person, and
    despite the parallels, she is NOTHING like Sam or Dean. I hope we never
    see her again.

    Actually, disappearing like that seems to be on course with characters on Supernatural. Hunters and other monsters can use any contact you have with your past life to trace you. Kevin did something similar with his mother. As for her sister, she was trying to save her life and she knew from personal experience that the hunger was survivable. Her characterization seems quite consistent - she stays away from her family because she believes it to be best for them but keeps tabs on her. She turns her sister only out of desperation and tries her hardest to keep her on the straight and narrow. And when that fails, she does what she promised.

    Sam/Dean: I found all their interactions to be "off." What were all
    those conversations about. Dean’s last line literally had me thinking,
    “What are you talking about, Dean?” All of Dean’s angst, guilt, or
    embarrassment was unearned just like Sam’s desperation to save Dean was
    unearned. It really goes back to my chief complaint this year: the DD
    arc was too short and too tame. What is Dean feeling so
    guilty/embarrassed about? What did he do as a demon that was so awful? I
    saw nothing. Drinking, watching porn, singing, killing other demons,
    hanging with Crowley? What? Those things aren’t so awful that Dean
    should be wracked w/guilt or self-loathing. Trying to kill Sam? That’s
    not the first time a supernaturally influenced Dean tried to kill Sam so
    Dean shouldn’t be upset about that either. Lester? That guy was a
    douche who put out a contract on his wife? Dean shouldn’t be losing
    sleep or needing rest b/c of that. All the "are you ready" stuff had me
    thinking, "What are they talking about? Ready for what? What's the
    problem?"


    But we didn't see any wracking with guilt or self-loathing. Compare this Dean to the one from season 4 - after he'd tortured people on the rack - and you'll notice the difference. He does feel guilty about his time as a demon but its nowhere near as bad as it was in the past. Not yet, anyway. He made some really bad choices here, but luckily, there were no lasting consequences that we know of. And the whole "being ready" was about being able to handle violent situations. Try and remember that the MoC was making Dean violent even before he had the blade and since he still has the mark, Sam has every reason to be concerned.

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  67. Does she? When everyone is pointing out her flaws left and right?

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  68. Are they flaws, though? In my opinion, they are making her look strong and independent. Young writers are looking for characters that they can use as 'proxies' so to speak. Maybe she isn't 100% stereotypical Mary Sue, but she's as close as any character in this show will ever be (...with the exception of Charlie the queen of Mary Sues).

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  69. She was too afraid to go back to her family, but couldn't let them go either, so she cyber-stalked them.

    She couldn't let her sister die when it was her time.
    She couldn't keep her sister on the straight and narrow.

    She keeps struggling with her nature and is afraid she'll lose control but isn't brave enough to kill herself.
    She stays on the run without building a life.
    She is not out there fighting monsters or saving innocents.

    All she is trying to do is survive what has happened to her.



    All in all, she is behaving like a normal person thrust in a situation beyond her control - not particularly strong or brave or independent, but someone who hasn't given in to her instincts either. Being the average Jane is definitely not a defining trait for a Mary Sue.



    As for Charlie, it was only in her most recent appearance that she was treated as a Mary Sue. Her role before that was fine.

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  70. In the episodes, she is treated like a Mary Sue despite of her "flaws" that may or may not be considered flaws in this fandom. She is also not just an average Jane, she is someone who has overcome difficulties like only a Mary Sue would, and continues to do so. Like I said, she's not a 100% stereotypical Mary Sue character, but there are many things that point in that direction. Those things appeal to young fanfiction writers, and they will "develop" the character into an even more stereotypical Mary Sue in their stories.

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  71. Charlie hit our screens as a Mary Sue. It worked in her first episode, when the viewers didn’t know she was going to be shoved down our throats like castor oil on a scheduled basis. Even in her first episode, she was written as this amazing character that amazing stuff was happening to only because she had these amazing computer skills and, of course, she was the big damned heroine. She was not written as a character that someone would actually exist as a real person; first and foremost, because how many high school dropouts do you know who work in the IT department of a multi-national corporation.

    Mary Sue’s are characters that other characters are drawn to, who think all Mary Sue ideas are brilliant, all their jokes funny, all their advice amazingly insightful, and they feel so drawn to them that they will feel comfortable talking to them about their problems.

    Charlie was immediately so awesome in her first appearance, and so special, that Dick Roman told her he knew all about her most excellent
    hacking skills and told her (and the audience) that Charlie had a unique ‘spark’ that only some humans have and that she was so special that she just couldn’t be copied.

    In LARP, we again saw the ‘sympathetic lesbian’ character (whom even fairies were overcome with in their worship of her awesomeness (ignoring Dean Friggin’ Winchester, who never even warranted a sideways glance from any female) in a strictly faux girl power story…and she was again the heroine saving the Winchesters.

    Two more episodes and Charlie is an insta-hunter on the level of the Winchesters by reading some books, and then she goes off to conquer a different realm; an accomplishment that even the Winchesters have not
    done.

    I can see how some would think Charlie is not a Mary Sue; that she may be well enough developed as a character to escape that label, but there is enough of that Mary Sue in Charlie, if for no other reason that she always trumps in every situation. The only reason we get this character over and
    over again is that Thompson is the sugar daddy for that character, and that is the only clear reason that the character is pushed, pushed and pushed some more at the fans. It certainly is not that she brings in great ratings, because she does not.

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  72. In the episodes, she is treated like a Mary Sue despite of her "flaws"
    that may or may not be considered flaws in this fandom. She is also not
    just an average Jane, she is someone who has overcome difficulties like
    only a Mary Sue would, and continues to do so. Like I said, she's not a
    100% stereotypical Mary Sue character, but there are many things that
    point in that direction.

    What difficulties did she overcome that only a Mary Sue would. Her backstory is tragic enough, but not unrealistically so - her entire village wasn't killed by an evil overlord who then tortured her for days. Sure, there was some element of emotional trauma, but we've seen far, far worse in other guest stars. The only difficulty for her to overcome is her bloodlust and doing that doesn't make her a Mary Sue since we've seen a number of monsters on the show capable of doing it.

    As far as I can see, she doesn't have any major flaws and she doesn't have any major strengths either - she is totally and completely average, which is the opposite of being Mary Sue.

    Those things appeal to young fanfiction writers, and they will "develop" the character into an even more stereotypical Mary Sue in their
    stories.


    Except, in the fiction I read, she isn't "developed" at all. Her purpose is to either validate or invalidate the brothers' decision to spare her. Not becoming a Mary Sue.

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  73. I get that you like her and want to argue each and every point. Hey, Robbie Thompson likes her, too, and Singer, so I don't think you have to worry about whether she is a Mary Sue or not -- episodes will continue to be written specifically for Felicia Day and she will continue to be all things awesome.

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  74. Not particularly. I like her well enough as a guest star who shows up when it makes sense to the plot and I prefer that she stick to the role laid out - that of a geeky hunter dipping her toe in the world of monsters. If Winchesters have any tech-related problems or any cases relating to the nerd-subculture then by all means, bring her her back and that would make for a fun episode.


    I'm not a fan of gratuitous reappearance for any guest star, no matter how "popular" they seem to be. That goes for Charlie, Garth, Krissy, Kate or the Ghostfacers. And I'm certainly not a fan of gratuitous reappearance where the guest star is inexplicably made the focus of the story without reasonable parallels being drawn with the Winchesters - which is why I wasn't a fan of her last appearance. Which is also why I don't think I'll be a fan of her next appearance, which is, I believe, in episode 10 titled "There is no place like home".

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  75. A bit about the next episode. Not sure if this is the right place to say it - but it is about expected gripes. On the other hand it is based on the promos, so it might be a bit spoilery. Whether or not I like the episode would depend on how many of these gripes appear in it - and if they do, I'll atleast have the satisfaction of having predicted them.


    *Spoilers*

    Here are the things I'm afraid of regarding this episode:

    1. Terrible singing: The little bit we heard of the musical wasn't good at all. Sitting through a whole episode of teenage girls having a sub-par musical play which ends up somehow "appealing" to the Winchesters isn't a good idea at all.

    2. Ignoring Canon: Not the play itself but the basis of the play. IIRC, the Supernatural books in-universe - stopped coming out after Dean went to hell. So Cas shouldn't be in it and Bobby shouldn't be in a wheelchair. And since Chuck has been MIA since season 5, there should be no story beyond it - which means, Crowley shouldn't feature as a major character.

    3. Forced lessons: I'm afraid the supposed takeaway of the episode would be some "valuable" lesson the boys get from the crappy play about their lives - like how much they mean to each-other or how much they've accomplished in the world. Really, they need singing tweens to tell them that.

    4. Wrong Messages: That all of Supernatural fans are giggling, slash-loving, fiction-writing teenage girls or have the mental age of one (like Becky). That would be some love letter to the fans.

    5. Pushover MoTW: It'd be quite terrible if they end up needing the girls to help them with the case. Nothing would take away more from a difficult and life-threatening job more than a pre-teen girl doing it. Oh, wait - I just remembered Krissy.

    These are my fears. I very much hope they won't come true. But lately, I find, I should be prepared for the worst.

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  76. I am going to watch the 200th, because I think I deserve it, but I am feeling very devalued at the moment. Based on the recent interviews from:

    Thompson, who went on and on about the fanfic written about the show; how the "fans" took something and made it into their own, and how wonderful that is.

    How Carver said he was so impressed with the 13-15 year olds that attend the cons and go "toe-to-toe with the Js" that they want to honor those fans.

    How Kripke said that some of those fans were 2 and 3 years old when the show started and now this whole new generation is loving and supporting it.

    I am going into this thinking that the 200th is a "love letter to THOSE fans," and not THIS fan, who is way past the 13-15 year old group and who actually started with this show. Now, I am not surprised by that, since for the last two years, the show has been about teenage emoting, 'feelings,' and angst all over the place. I figured out a long time ago who the target audience was and that I'm not one of them and that Carver and the CW want to change the show to suit that age group.

    I would feel much better if Edlund were writing this story about adolescent girls in drag living their lives out by singing the story of the Winchesters, because Thompson is not even close to being an Edlund.
    Those are my worries, but like you, I've come to expect nothing from this stable of writers. Still, I'm going to watch and, with maybe a lot of hunter's helper, go into it with an open mind.

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