"Thea will find herself in a precarious predicament and she will be saved by her father," executive producer Andrew Kreisberg teases. "Malcolm is going to offer her what she doesn't have anymore. That was part of our math with killing Moira [Susanna Thompson]. If we were going to send Thea in that direction, she needed to have nothing pulling her back here. Now she has a brother [Stephen Amell] who lied to her and has done something unforgivable and no mother. On the flip side, she has Malcolm Merlyn saying, 'I will never lie to you, Thea.'"
Malcolm won't be the only former member of the League of Assassins returning in the season-ender. In fact, Sara (Caity Lotz) returns to town with Nyssa al Ghul (Katrina Law) and the League in tow. "[Sara] went to go get help because when you're fighting an army, you need an army," Kreisberg says. "She goes and gets Nyssa and she comes back with the League. It's the Arrow, Canary, Roy [Colton Haynes] and the League of Assassins versus Slade and his Mirakuru army for the city."
Malcolm won't be the only former member of the League of Assassins returning in the season-ender. In fact, Sara (Caity Lotz) returns to town with Nyssa al Ghul (Katrina Law) and the League in tow. "[Sara] went to go get help because when you're fighting an army, you need an army," Kreisberg says. "She goes and gets Nyssa and she comes back with the League. It's the Arrow, Canary, Roy [Colton Haynes] and the League of Assassins versus Slade and his Mirakuru army for the city."
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YES! Let the Malcolm and Slade showdown commence! Surely they're not foolish enough to pass up this opportunity?
ReplyDeleteThe more hints they drop about the direction they're taking Thea, the more I dread it. If Thea becomes besties with Malcolm I may retch. Petulant Thea is hard enough to take as is so the very idea of 'dark side' Thea is very disheartening to say the least.
ReplyDeleteI wish Oliver would tell Thea that he recently found out about Malcolm being her father and that he hasn't been lying to her for years like Thea currently believes. Thea would be a fool to trust Malcolm especially since she knows he was the mastermind behind the Undertaking.
ReplyDeleteThink Oliver needed to tell Thea that he was the Arrow in last week's episode and come clean to her about everything, but now it looks like it will be too late and she will be under the influence of Malcolm.
ReplyDeletePersonally I'd love to see joining the dark side with her father. Especially because I want Malcolm to train so in the future she can become Speedy.
ReplyDeleteExactly. Oliver lied to her about everything so it's obvious why she wouldn't trust him. Also Oliver killed plenty of people last season.
ReplyDeleteI really hope they have John Barrowman as a regular next season.
ReplyDeleteMalcolm is far from Thea's only training option. There are other ways to go about it without having do deal with that mess.
ReplyDeleteWhen Laurel joins Team Arrow, and it looks like she does, it will be Oliver, Laurel, Sara ,Diggle, Felicity and Roy (in order of probable screen time). There won't be room for Thea to have any real stories of her own. Since Willa Holland is a good actress, I'd rather see her with Malcolm then fighting for the non-Oliver/Laurel/Sara time.
ReplyDelete... but Oliver killed the bad guys. Malcolm didn't care if he killed innocent men, women, and children with the Undertaking. I understand Oliver not telling Thea he is the Arrow because that knowledge would put her in enormous danger. That's why Oliver encouraged Thea to leave town. Oliver loves his sister and wants her in his life, only he knows she is safer the further away Thea is from him.
ReplyDeleteBut she doesn't know that. He never spoke to her about those things and many times this season she has told him to stop lying to her. I understand what you mean but it's not that far fetched why she would leave with Malcolm.
ReplyDeleteI agree. Also I don't care about the ships or the love drama in this show so I'd rather see family drama and conflicts that don't revolve around love triangles.
ReplyDeleteIf that means having to put up with Thea in her current state or, worse yet, back to her mid-season one state then no thanks. Roy and Thea will likely to continue to have their own subplots into season three along with Sin on a recurring basis so I'm not concerned about screen time so, once again, Malcolm training Thea is unnecessary.
ReplyDeleteWhat's the problem with Thea this season? She matured a lot and she had every right to be upset with her mother and Oliver. God forbid somebody gets mad for a logical reason in this show.
ReplyDeleteAnd Roy/Thea are incredible boring. Their subplot is unnecessary.
Thea's plot mid-season one was about being an immature teenager to give Oliver the chance to tell Moira she needs to shape up and be a better parent. Moira did, and I haven't found Thea annoying since then. In fact, when Laurel was going through her drunk stage, Thea was a welcome adult. I don't see any indication that she would need to go back to the annoyed state.
ReplyDeleteUntil Thea got kidnapped by Slade, she had barely anything to do on the show. Roy had one episode dealing with getting mirakuru'ed before the show moved on, and Sin's only been a bit player. I'd like to see more of these three but that's not the way the show's been heading. It fits them in when there enough time to take about from Oliver/Laurel/Sara.
She did mature a lot until she once again lost perspective. Being mad at he mother and Oliver is fine. They did lie to her after all. However, the extent to which she is taking this is way, way over the top and stretches the bounds of reason all for dramatic effect. Arrow has taken something with real weight and turned it to pure melodrama.
ReplyDeleteI won't disagree about Roy. Thea and Sin are the only people that make him interesting. That's why it's so much better when those three interact at once.
The show really doesn't do romantic relationships well. The only two realistic ones have been Moira/Walter and Thea/Roy and both of those broke up.
ReplyDeleteAs for Oliver ping-ponging between Laurel's bed and Sara's. the less time spent on that the better.
During Laurel's tailspin, everyone around Laurel seemed like a responsible adult by comparison. That's not saying much.
ReplyDeleteAs for screen time and stuff to do, Roy and Thea are both firmly in the supporting character category and will only get so much screen time anyway. Spending that limited screen time getting brainwashed by Malcolm is nothing but a big character setback waiting to happen.
Personally I don't care about any of the Oliver ships and I'm tired of the ship wars. Also the people who expect Oliver to stay with one girl are delusional. I think Sara will die in the season finale. I like her but the show is becoming too crowded.
ReplyDeleteAlso I hope romance keeps being a secondary plot.
I agree that Moira/Walter were the best couple so far and I wish we could have seen more of Sara/Nyssa.
Roy/Thea is just boring and their relationship became boring after two episodes.
Like you said Willa is a good actress so I hope she gets her own storyline next season and it would be really stupid to miss the chance of having her share screentime with Malcolm. Also if they are planning to keep Malcolm around they need to make him more three dimensional.
Diggle's relationship is the second most interesting one....
ReplyDeleteI disagree. Thea being angry was actually realistic. I'm tired of characters getting over things in like two episodes. Also some people seem to forget Thea doesn't know a lot of things so she can't "understand" why her mother and Oliver lied to her.
ReplyDeleteI forget about that one but you are right! It's funny how the secondary couples are a million times better than the main couples.
ReplyDeleteI never said she should be over it. I'm saying the extent to which her anger is being taken is over the top and melodramatic.
ReplyDeleteI don't know if Thea being around Malcolm means that she fully joins the dark side, if by dark side you mean becoming a villain. I can see Malcolm using the the potential desire for revenge or vengeance to get Thea to train with him, and Thea becoming the kind of person Oliver does not want her to end up being.
ReplyDeleteBut it does give Malcolm Merlyn something to do other than just be cray-cray, and it's fun seeing John Barrowman chew the scenery.
ReplyDeleteOnce a villain has been determined to be a villain, the show doesn't quite know what to do with him anymore. Slade's been kind of boring in the last few episodes..
I just wish Diggle was given his due more this season. He's more interesting than Roy, and I think he could have easily been turned into a hooded-sidekick as well.
ReplyDeleteI agree. I loved his episode but many fans complained they didn't like it because there's wasn't enough Oliver. I thought it was one of the best episodes of the season.
ReplyDeleteMy problem with Arrow, in part, is because of this. They are more or less copying the Dark Knight movies and using them to establish their villains. Merlyn is Ras from Batman Begins; Blood is Scarecrow; Vertigo is Joker, and Slade is Bane.
ReplyDeleteMy problems with Slade are more about his motivation and not that he's a villain. I'm cool with him being a full-on villain. He's been a grade-A pain in the ass in a good way.
ReplyDeleteAs for Malcolm, I don't want to give the impression that I don't want Thea sharing a plot or screen time with Malcolm because she absolutely should. I would just like that interaction to be something more realistic. Something more of an uneasy, tenuous relationship where where Thea is never quite sure what Malcolm is really after or what his true motives are. Orphan Black is a show that's good at displaying those types of dynamics between characters.
I don't think she will become a villain but I can see Malcolm getting into her head so she stays with him. Like he said she is the only thing he has left.
ReplyDeleteI also thought it was one of the best this season, and the most capable of producing further stories with Waller, using her as a major antagonist for S3, with a role that is not really a "villain" in goal, but certainly will act like one with the means she uses.
ReplyDeleteThe romantic relationship for Oliver that works for me is the one with Shado. Sure it got a little muddled with Slade falling in love with her as well, but she got killed off before any potential love triangle happened, and Shado might have been the first time Oliver truly fell in love with a woman.
ReplyDeleteThe interaction might be close to what you are thinking, we have yet to see how Thea responds to Malcolm.
ReplyDeleteArrow hasn't shown itself to be a program that displays such nuance in character relationships so I'm pessimistic about their upcoming dynamic until I see a reason not to be.
ReplyDeleteThe other thing with Waller is she could be a way to change the dynamics of the show, turning it away from the Batman films and into something of its own. She would be a challenge to Oliver, both seeking in their own ways, to "save" people, with Oliver seeing her "ends justifies the means" leading her to do all kinds of evil, thus helping him complete his journey as a hero by seeing what he could easily become.
ReplyDeleteHonestly, I don't get all the fuss about 'that' lie. If I'd have a daughter with a mass murderer, I wouldn't tell her either. Like, never. What good could do to her?
ReplyDeleteHonestly Thea siding with Malcolm would not make any sense. True that Oliver lied to Thea about her parentage. But its not an unforgivable offense where as Malcolm leveled the Glades and killed 502 people. Her getting swayed by such a person will be truly unbelievable. Even if Malcolm outs "Oliver is the Arrow" secret to Thea still Arrow is so much better than Dark Archer.
ReplyDeleteIf it was real life Thea would have raged at Moira and then at Oliver as an afterthought, when she found out about Merlyn. But since everything has to revolve around Oliver she had to blame him the most.
The same way if it was real world Slade would have raged and gone after Ivo and blamed Oliver as an afterthought, but Oliver is the axis on which everything spins so.....
You're preaching to the choir. I've no objections to Thea interacting with Malcolm as long as it makes sense. Getting close to the guy who murdered your father, shipwrecked your brother, repeatedly threatened and blackmailed your mother, murdered 500+ people by manufacturing an earthquake, sent Starling City into an economic depression, and killed your half-brother in the process would make no sense whatsoever.
ReplyDeleteI agree completely. It's the extent of the anger that seems a bit far fetched. I thought the same thing about how Oliver practically disowned his Mother for not telling him that Malcolm was actually Thea's father. So now Thea apparently despises Oliver (not just mad at him) because he didn't tell her he was the Arrow and (I guess) because she blames him more or less for her Mother's death - a Mother she had already pretty much disowned. But hey, it's TV land and logic is frequently twisted to support the plot and sub-plots of the show.
ReplyDelete"But hey, it's TV land and logic is frequently twisted to support the plot and sub-plots of the show."
ReplyDeleteThat is unfortunately very, very true... especially on The CW.
It makes more sense than Thea being on Team Arrow or Oliver training Thea. Oliver will probably be busy training or mentoring Roy. There is also the fact that she is his brother and he's overprotective.
ReplyDelete"It makes more sense than Thea being on Team Arrow or Oliver training Thea"
ReplyDeleteTraining with Oliver and his people doesn't make a lot of sense right now either but making less sense than training with Malcolm? Not a chance.
They are doing it OTT on purpose to drive her to Malcolm
ReplyDeleteSubtle this show ain't.
Very true. Between that and Arrow's increasing willingness to bend logic to conveniently fit their narrative, Arrow is becoming a little too close to some other typical CW fare. It's disappointing to see.
ReplyDeleteWhat I wouldn't give for Arrow to have one fifth the intelligence and subtlety of Orphan Black.
ReplyDeleteI think several of the actors could do it (Salmon, Ramsey, Thompson, Bennett, Blackthorne, Amell has reached the stage and maybe EBR) and Holland, but not the writers (See: Wilson,Slade, motivation).
I agree that most of the Arrow cast has the chops to do justice to more challenging scripts but, playing devil's advocate here, maybe we're asking too much of a superhero show on a youth-oriented network? I'd love to see the writers up their game a few notches but I just don't think that anyone with a show on that network has the cojones to try it.
ReplyDeleteAs for Berlanti, I don't know what else he has on his plate so I'm not knowledgeable to speculate on that.
Sure it is. He literally tried to do something that would have killed thousands of people, and everyone knows this. Oliver could be Jack the Ripper... it still wouldn't make any sense for Thea to get together with someone else that she knows is also a serial killer.
ReplyDeleteI can accept as Thea making the decision, but that's because I know that people make stupid, weak-willed decisions when they're in crisis. And that's exactly the sort of decision this is.
In order for Merlyn to be BB's Ra's al Ghul he would need to be in some sort of mentorship situation over Oliver and (to make your Scarecrow analogy work) he would also need to be involved with Sebastian Blood. Both of those roles are filled by Slade.
ReplyDeleteI gotta say, I don't really see how any of your comparisons work, except perhaps Blood's. The fact that Ra's al Ghul exists in the shadows of Arrow largely prevents the show's villains from becoming expys of anyone but Joker, who wasn't part of the League of Shadows. But Vertigo became a pawn of Slade, making him fundamentally unlike Joker in every way but his flamboyantness.
luv Willa!!!
ReplyDeletehttp://herocomplex.latimes.com/tv/arrow-seth-gabels-take-on-vertigo-inspired-by-ledgers-joker/ the authors and the actor point out Vertigo is Joker/Heath Ledger inspired.
ReplyDeleteAs for Merlyn, just look at the goal of Ras and Merlyn and why they do what they do: all the corruption requires destruction. It's the goal which connects them (as well as Merlyn's connection to Tommy and Moira and Thea makes him a kind of mentor).
He is panned as writer and producer for Arrow and next year Flash. Then producer on the Tomorrow People, he is also producing a pilot for NBC called The mysteries of Laura.
ReplyDeleteThey point out that Vertigo's performance is Joker-inspired, which is what I said vis-a-vis flamboyantness. The modus operendi and raison d'etre of the characters themselves are extremely different. For instance, the Joker would never allow himself to operate as a crony in the way that Vertigo did with Slade.
ReplyDeleteAs for Merlyn, the "destroying a corrupt society" motivation is pretty much behind half of all bad guy motivations. Off the top of my head, I can think of Orphan Black, Continuum, and Defiance, as three shows that have villains with a similar motivation. (Not to mention the real life Christian groups that want to stabilize Israel for the sole purpose of hastening the "end times".)
"Burning away corruption" is too general a motivation to make Merlyn a Ra's expy.
I'm probably in the minority here, but I'm glad they're focusing a little more on Thea! I mean, if I were her, I would be just as upset. Although her not signing that paper in order for the Queens to keep all their assets was the most stupid and selfish thing she ever did... But hey, what is a character without faults?
ReplyDeleteI like that Thea values honesty. I like that she is upset with Oliver because she has a right to be and doesn't shy away from expressing her feelings. Her life has pretty much hit rock bottom at this point so I'm not surprised that she might flea the city with Malcolm. Desperate times call for desperate measures right?
While I don't want Thea to become a villain (I would've preferred if Laurel became one but alas, I don't think the writers are heading that direction), I want the writers to make her come to her own senses, learn that Merlyn is evil, go back to Starling, and be there for Oliver (the only person who truly loves her). I don't want the writers to oversimplify her arc like they did with Laurel's, so I'm okay with the pace they're going with for Thea as I'm 100% certain she'll come out of this a lot stronger and more badass than she was before.