This is something I'd need confirmation for. I'm skeptical. I'm looking forward to seeing Mark as Brenda Leigh Johnson's lawyer on The Closer. So, there's that.
If Sam remembering Hell is going to play a big part in the season I hope there's some twist to it. I'd rather not get half a season of seeing Sam getting his ass kicked by Michael and Lucifer in the cage.
I remember Jared saying stuff about how we'll get to see some of what Sam saw in Hell. I also remember Jared saying from ComicCon and at NerdHQ that Sam would get flashes of Hell, that there may be times where it looks like Sam is talking to himself but that he could be talking to someone/something that only he can see. Since we know we're gonna get bits of Sam's Hell, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Sam is seeing Lucifer as he knows and remembers him the most and that's in "Nick's" form which is the body Lucifer inhabited until he took Sam's for just a bit in Swan Song. It's been repeatedly drilled into our heads since the angels that humans are limited to seeing an angel's true form, that it's so inhuman, that an actual human being (unless they're special) can lay eyes on an angel's true form without their eyes burning out of their skulls. If Sam is seeing something we can't, struggling with his realities or having flashbacks of his time in the cage which was with Lucifer, Lucifer is going to need form. Why not Mark? That's how Sam would best remember Lucifer after all.
confusing, I mean Lucifer left Nick's vessel pretty ruined, but it is SPN and all things are possible. I am going with Sam having flashbacks but love the chance to see Mark Pellegrino on SPN again!
I'm not that concerned with how they'll show what happened to Sam. If they want to blend his realities and confuse the hell out of him, that's fine by me. I'm referring to exactly WHAT happened while he was down there. I'm hoping its not just the obvious.
^^; weird since Nick body was destroy....and he never went in the cage either, unless they just decide that they didn't want to have Jared play both Sam and Luciferat the same time in a chat
It would be awesome if Castiel removes all the competition, brings Lucifer and Michael - the last 2 living archangels - back from the cage and then kills them. And since Cass is not actually God but just a really really powerful angel then taking out the last two strong competitors for good would be cool to see, eventhough they are already locked up
Mark Pellegrino's gonna be on The Closer? Woohoo! That must be starting next week, considering this week's events.
Personally, I'd love to see Nick come back, as I felt he wasn't ever properly explored as a character. Sadly, I have zero interest in Sam's hellpain. Half of the season six finale was well over enough of that. I sure hope that the rumours about Matt Frewer don't mean that every time a dead character comes back, it's a Sam hallucination. That kind of cheat would get old about 30 seconds into the first time they did it.
We got a lot more information about Dean's Hell in On the Head of a Pin than we got about Sam's Hell all through season 6 and that doesn't count the peek we got at the end of Season 3 when he was sent to Hell and nearly the entire Lazarus Rising episode when we actually got to see him come back from Hell... and the flash backs and the talks on the hood of the Impala and the actual estimate of the time he spent down there... and his own personal little demon, Alistair, coming back to haunt him... For Sam's Hell we basically got 5 episodes of "I'm back and not quite right"... Then, we only got that tiny flash from the beginning of Mannequin and the End of Unforgiven and the short peek at Hell Sam. We did get a lot of warnings, but not much information.
I don't care in the least about Sam's hell and furthermore, I think that's because the show has made no effort whatsoever to make me care. We kept hearing that it was the worst, most awful experience ever and what did we see? Crappy CGI flames. Sambot boring us with yet more of his "I'm the best hunter, ever" shtick. Woobie Hell Sammy. And none of it had anything to do with the season plot, so what was it doing in half of the season finale?
Dean's hell was shown. Its effects were clearly demonstrated. They were scary. We got it. We didn't need to revisit it with a carbon-copy version for Sam. And Dean has not been portrayed for six solid seasons with only one character arc--there's something wrong with him! The first time it came up that Sam might have something wrong with him, there was some mystery to it. Now, it's like, "Turn the page, show."
There is nothing new to see here with Sam's hellpain. If there were, we'd have seen it last season, when it was still relevant. I get that mileage varies and all that, but there are excellent reasons for why that plot didn't work for a lot of fans and there is nothing negative about pointing them out.
Also, more to the point, if the only reason to bring back dead characters is to show them in Sam's hallucinations, that will get old fast. Remember how underwhelming YED's appearance in Exile on Main Street turned out to be when we found out he wasn't real? Like that. I don't get why fans scream and yell about powerful characters like Death and God being around as dei ex machina, yet aren't bothered by story concepts with built-in Magic Reset Buttons. There are no story consequences to Lucifer being Sam's hallucination, aside from giving Sam (and us) a temporary scare. It's lazy.
Now, if they want to do something original like explore Nick's possible relation to the brothers or have something happen with Lucifer and Michael that doesn't bring them back as the whiners they turned into in Swan Song, or sideline the brothers in their own story, I'm all for it. Pellegrino's a great actor. There are good ways to bring him back and that might be what we end up with. Bringing him back as a Lucifer hallucination? Not so good.
I think it would be helpful for Sam's character development to really see what happened in the cage and that would require some Lucifer time. My only question is who exactly saw him, from the original tweets we never got the name of the mysterious "person she was following" that saw MP.
I guess it would be pretty cool if they found a good way to bring him back. I've loved the guy ever since I saw him in Dexter, he's such an amazing actor.
Yay! (assuming it's a Sam flashback or hallucination). I liked Pellegrino as Lucifer, and I'd like to see see more of the interactions between Sam and Luci after they went into the cage. We had five years of suggestions that Sam belongs on the dark/demon side, even though the only Sam we saw was a very kind person with occasional anger issues. Season 5's finale included a conversation between Luci and Sam in which Luci says that Sam was always drawn to him and that Sam felt an "exhileration" with being connected with Luci. I want to hear Sam's response to this. I also want to know if Sam still has his anger, if he still has his powers, if him being "the boy king" gave him a different relationship with demons. I want the gaps filled in and his five-season story arc tied up properly.
Creepy.. these are all my tweets. Anyway maybe Mark's return has something to do with Sam's wall falling down or maybe even a flashback. The least thing would be if Castiel did something in order to release Lucifer.. or maybe GODCastiel! has plans to smite Lucifer?! I guess we'll just have to wait and see!!
The way to make people care about a story is to write a story and show what happened, and it seems like that's what they're doing. Sam has a different backstory, was brought to Hell for a different reason than Dean, and was with Lucifer and Michael, so it's unlikely that Sam's story will be a carbon-copy of Dean's.
i know they are currently filiming season 2 of being human, but i cant remember if mark died in the first season finale LOL....anyways, be cool to see him back as lucifer :D
holy crap if that is true then i bet maybe Castiel that stuck up 'god' wanted maybe to show his power off with a challenge and fighting lucifer. So maybe he released him but Lucifer escaped the fight? Or maybe Lucifer lost his powers when escaping.
I WOULDNT COUNT ON IT BEING MEMORIES GUYS!!!! If it were memories from hell then where is Jake Abel who played Adam and Michael? They were with him in hell? Dont count on it. If anything maybe lucifer's soul is talking to him somehow but dont count on it being memories.
Sounds to me like you're bitter Sam spent more time in Hell than Dean and that we're actually going to get to see what happened to him in Hell this season.
Since these are all your tweets, maybe you could provide us with more information as to who saw Mark and if it's honestly true so we can have some real confirmation that Mark may actually be back?
i follow someone who lives in Vancouver and likes tracking down where the cast and crew shoot the show and she tweeted that Mark Pellegrino was on set shooting. Oh and they were shooting at some sort of bar.
You are basically saying that they skipped Sam's Hell Story in Season 6, so why bother in 7? You also said that they showed enough of it when they really didn't show anything at all. It sounds like they can't make you care about anything having to do with "wooby" Sam. It will only satisfy you if they cover Sam's time in Hell through different characters. Why don't we tell the whole story of the Winchesters through other characters and give Jared and Jensen a nice long vacation.... NOPE, not gonna happen.
Oh great! There's one character I never want to see back on Supernatural again. Weepy Lucifer was a downpoint for the series. This better be a flash back or a nightmare and a short one at that. I do not want to go through Lucifer's daddy issues again.
Yes, they pretty much said he couldn't hold Lucifer. Considering everyone else died, he should be dead too. This would be the worst retcon of them all if he comes back.
I would much rather see him on The Closer than Supernatural. He's a good actor trapped in a terrible character on this show. He deserves a better part.
I doubt there was a bar in hell, although with Crowley who knows. My guess is this is one of those times when Sam can't tell what is real and what isn't. A waking nightmare of some sort.
Not memories per se but more Lucifer taunting him in his dreams/hallucinations. Kind of like Lilith going after Dean in Yellow Fever. She wasn't really there but it seemed real at the time.
No freaking kidding! I'd hope it is a small part of the season because half a season of Sam angst is not appealing to me. I want action, wins, and brothers fighting monsters together.
Hey maybe the boys randomly run into Lucifer's discarded meat suit in the bar - maybe Mark's not Lucifer at all? We don't know what happened to Nick after Luci swapped suits. That could happen. Maybe.
Interesting idea. I don't think they will go there but it does suit Cas' new pesonality. My question is do Michael and Lucifer have a physical form in the cage? They were borrowing Adam and Sam, but obviously Cas was able to get Sam's form out if not his soul. So Lucifer must have detached from Sam relatively quickly.
I agree that Lucifer as a hallucination is even less scary than Lucifer in decaying flesh and he was underwhelming in that construct. I'd had enough of both Michael and Lucifer by Swan Song too. If we get them back it will sideline the brothers again and I don't need anymore of that.
That meat suit was pretty gooey and rotty....Nick was a decaying mess by the end of his stint as Lucifer's Angel condom. My bet, if this is true, it's part of Sam's wall issues and not being able to distinguish between reality and his memorie of the pit. They've sad that his wall is going to impact on his ability to perceive what is real or not....I'd say, he's seeing things. Awesome news though, totally dig Mark P and as awkward as this always is to say, just loved Lucifer!
Since my post was deleted and I have no idea why considering I wasn't nasty or rude or attacking the characters unlike this post...
"Sambot boring us with yet more of his "I'm the best hunter, ever" shtick. Woobie Hell Sammy."
Judging by all of this, I'm gathering you've attempted to discreetly find a reason to attack Sam, referring to his Hell self as "Woobie Hell Sammy" kinda gives that away. Not so discreet, fyi.
"Dean's hell was shown. Its effects were clearly demonstrated. They were scary. We got it. We didn't need to revisit it with a carbon-copy version for Sam."
And what makes you think that this is going to be a carbon-copy version for Sam if I may ask? I certainly don't see Sam's Hell as a carbon-copy. Especially considering Sam jumped into Hell body AND soul under completely different circumstances, and especially considering that Sam was in an entirely DIFFERENT part of Hell than what Dean was and not on the rack or surrounded by demons, but instead trapped in Lucifer's cage with Michael and Lucifer UNLIKE what Dean went through.
So please answer me exactly how Dean's Hell compared to Sam's Hell is a "carbon-copy" as you put it, because I'm not seeing it. To me, it sounds like you're angry because Sam now has a Hell storyline that they didn't just leave hanging up in the air, to which I'm grateful they didn't because fans of Sam deserve to know and Sam has a character deserves to have it explored.
You claim there is nothing new to see here with Sam's Hell experience, just how exactly do you know this? Are you close friends with the writers or something? I mean I'm bordering on sheer curiosity here since you seem to know so much about Sam and what he went through while in Hell.
If MP is on the show and if Sam is flashing back, there is a reason for it that will advance the story. Screenwriting 101, every line advances the story. So, something that Lucifer does to him in the cage must affect the plot line in Season 7. No Michael and no Adam because they didn't torture him, hello?! Michael in Adam is more than capable of hitting Lucy without touching Sam, whereas Lucifer has Sam all tied up in his head. Still would LOVE to get independent verification. Anyone get verification of this from another source than "I follow someone who saw but I won't tell you who I follow"?
I liked Lucifer when he was only a threat in the talks, in season 4. He lost all of his scariness in the moment he actually appeared and started talking. With the exception of The End and Jared's kick ass performance.
I hope they wrap up the Hell storyline by the first half of the season. I'm not looking forward to dealing with more Hell memories. We went through this already with Dean.
thank you Jilly. Now this episode seems even worse. :-P Or maybe it can't be possibly worse than what I'm now thinking. Yeah, that's how I'm going to look at it.
I'm certain that we won't have Luci (or even Mikey) in the flesh, but I loved Lucifer!Nick and thought he was very scary. We going to have to agree to disagree with this one.
It was the show's attempt to have the fans "see" *anvil like parallels* between Lucifer and Sam that annoyed me more. (Leaving your family for a full ride at college makes you the Devil brother ;-) ).
I doubt MP's presence for a few moments even on a recurring basis will sideline the boys.
Sam is not a real person. Therefore, I can't insult him. I would appreciate it if you didn't use my opinion of a fictional character to insult *me*, as I am quite real.
As I said above, I get that some people would want to see this and that mileage varies, and that's okay. But I don't. I saw enough of Sam's Hell storyline last season to feel it was done poorly and that it didn't get any better the more they did it. I also disagree that it wasn't covered enough. It was covered to death.
We had Dean worrying that something was wrong with Sam for the first six episodes of season six. Then we had Dean worrying about Sam's soul in the cage for another five episodes (while being told by several characters, in excruciating detail, what it was like for Sam in the cage). Then we had the aftermath in the following episode, and Sam having flashbacks in the next, and three episodes after that, we had Samuel beating Sam up about what he did without his soul. Four episodes later, it came up again as a reason for a major break between two other characters, and then half of the season finale was sacrificed to Sam's reintegration inside his own head, even though it had nothing to do with what was going in the outside world and we had a whole bunch of other plot threads that needed tying up.
Other, quite viable, storylines were cut short or rushed so that we could revisit this storyline that wasn't even part of the major season plot. Sam didn't grow for half a season because it turned out he wasn't "really" Sam, and Sambot was written in a wildly inconsistent manner, so I don't see how that did Sam as a character any favours. We never got enough of a break from the storyline to miss it and now, they want to spend *another* season on it? Really?
Isn't there a point where these writers are going to realize that this plot isn't working, hasn't worked from the beginning, and they just need to throw in the towel and end it? They've ended plenty of other storylines in the past because they didn't work, including Dean's hell storyline (because, Kripke said outright, it would be too boring to watch either Dean or Sam turn into a drooling mess in a corner). How is this one any different?
Now, bringing back Mark Pellegrino? I'm all for that. But since one of the biggest fan objections to last season was the way they brought back dead characters, only to ruin them (like Samuel), that doesn't mean I want him to come back for something so pointless, that could easily be written in such a way that it wouldn't require a guest star of that calibre.
NOTE: Name-calling, personal attacks, spamming, excessive self-promotion, condescending pomposity, general assiness, racism, sexism, any-other-ism, homophobia, acrophobia, and destructive (versus constructive) criticism will get you BANNED from the party.
Interesting. If this is true, I'm thinking Sam is having flashbacks.
ReplyDeleteWow. This could be good. Or very very bad.
ReplyDeleteThis is something I'd need confirmation for. I'm skeptical. I'm looking forward to seeing Mark as Brenda Leigh Johnson's lawyer on The Closer. So, there's that.
ReplyDeleteIf this is true then I'm definitely thinking memories of hell, and not so much flashbacks. But we will see.
ReplyDeleteMr Pellegrino is awesome, so this news is welcome! I've no idea how it'd work, really. But still...
ReplyDeleteYay!
OMG it could be Sam remembering Hell. I'm pretty sure its been said that we're gonna see Sam's Hell
ReplyDeleteOh AWESOME. I bet that's the realities blurring for Sam, hell memories, epic angst, i'm all for it, woooo.
ReplyDeleteMemories from hell. Yes. If he's on the show, that's my odds-on favorite scenario.
ReplyDeleteI like this!
ReplyDeleteUm. total throw back to season 5.
ReplyDeleteNo, more like Sam remembering Lucifer as he knew and saw him best and most likely Hell flashbacks for Sam as well as Lucifer needing a form.
ReplyDeleteIf Sam remembering Hell is going to play a big part in the season I hope there's some twist to it. I'd rather not get half a season of seeing Sam getting his ass kicked by Michael and Lucifer in the cage.
ReplyDeleteI like this news, he was great on the show. I bet this is memories or flashbacks.
ReplyDeleteI remember Jared saying stuff about how we'll get to see some of what Sam saw in Hell. I also remember Jared saying from ComicCon and at NerdHQ that Sam would get flashes of Hell, that there may be times where it looks like Sam is talking to himself but that he could be talking to someone/something that only he can see. Since we know we're gonna get bits of Sam's Hell, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Sam is seeing Lucifer as he knows and remembers him the most and that's in "Nick's" form which is the body Lucifer inhabited until he took Sam's for just a bit in Swan Song. It's been repeatedly drilled into our heads since the angels that humans are limited to seeing an angel's true form, that it's so inhuman, that an actual human being (unless they're special) can lay eyes on an angel's true form without their eyes burning out of their skulls. If Sam is seeing something we can't, struggling with his realities or having flashbacks of his time in the cage which was with Lucifer, Lucifer is going to need form. Why not Mark? That's how Sam would best remember Lucifer after all.
ReplyDeletemore like the two realities blending so he's not sure which one he's in i'd bet, thats going to be awesome hopefully.
ReplyDeleteJared did say that Sam would be struggling with which reality he's in like is he in Hell is on earth with his brother, etc...
ReplyDeleteconfusing, I mean Lucifer left Nick's vessel pretty ruined, but it is SPN and all things are possible. I am going with Sam having flashbacks but love the chance to see Mark Pellegrino on SPN again!
ReplyDeleteI'm not that concerned with how they'll show what happened to Sam. If they want to blend his realities and confuse the hell out of him, that's fine by me. I'm referring to exactly WHAT happened while he was down there. I'm hoping its not just the obvious.
ReplyDeleteYay. This is the best thing that I heard today.
ReplyDeleteLOL PLEASE BE RIGHT
ReplyDeleteI'd say it's probably Sam having a flashback or maybe a hallucination
ReplyDelete^^; weird since Nick body was destroy....and he never went in the cage either, unless they just decide that they didn't want to have Jared play both Sam and Luciferat the same time in a chat
ReplyDeleteI think this just playing into the whole "Sam isn't alright" and hes mind is wrapping memories from the cage and showing him who tortured him.
ReplyDeleteIt would be awesome if Castiel removes all the competition, brings Lucifer and Michael - the last 2 living archangels - back from the cage and then kills them.
ReplyDeleteAnd since Cass is not actually God but just a really really powerful angel then taking out the last two strong competitors for good would be cool to see, eventhough they are already locked up
Oohh, fantastic! Maybe they'll do this whole Harry-Dexter kind of thing. =D
ReplyDeleteEither that or Sam has really lost it and we'll be seeing a three inch Lucifer propped on his shoulder. Does this mean Adam & Michael will be back?
This could be great! Awesome News!!
ReplyDeleteI'm really hoping this is true! it'd be great to see him back for an episode or two!
ReplyDeleteMark Pellegrino's gonna be on The Closer? Woohoo! That must be starting next week, considering this week's events.
ReplyDeletePersonally, I'd love to see Nick come back, as I felt he wasn't ever properly explored as a character. Sadly, I have zero interest in Sam's hellpain. Half of the season six finale was well over enough of that. I sure hope that the rumours about Matt Frewer don't mean that every time a dead character comes back, it's a Sam hallucination. That kind of cheat would get old about 30 seconds into the first time they did it.
it would be awesome to see him back an amazing actor!
ReplyDeleteOMFG he's gonna be her lawyer!?
ReplyDeleteI didn't think season 7 could get any better but it certainly just did.
That's going to be awesome!
Yeah. His character seems really cool. Here's the details:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.tvguide.com/News/Mark-Pellegrino-Closer-1034062.aspx
Yeah that has to be the case. Mark Pellegrino's character died when Lucifer left his body, correct?
ReplyDeleteI have mixed feelings about this...it would be interesting to see how him back but more Lucifer?!?
ReplyDeleteHe could of been visiting but if he is really going to come back....YAY!!!
ReplyDeleteYeah I somehow really doubt that considering Cas did this all to keep them IN the cage...
ReplyDelete"Half of the season six finale was well over enough of that."
ReplyDeleteUhhh, no it wasn't... We know jack all about Sam's Hell, so I dunno what show you've been watchin.
We got a lot more information about Dean's Hell in On the Head of a Pin than we got about Sam's Hell all through season 6 and that doesn't count the peek we got at the end of Season 3 when he was sent to Hell and nearly the entire Lazarus Rising episode when we actually got to see him come back from Hell... and the flash backs and the talks on the hood of the Impala and the actual estimate of the time he spent down there... and his own personal little demon, Alistair, coming back to haunt him...
ReplyDeleteFor Sam's Hell we basically got 5 episodes of "I'm back and not quite right"... Then, we only got that tiny flash from the beginning of Mannequin and the End of Unforgiven and the short peek at Hell Sam. We did get a lot of warnings, but not much information.
I don't care in the least about Sam's hell and furthermore, I think that's because the show has made no effort whatsoever to make me care. We kept hearing that it was the worst, most awful experience ever and what did we see? Crappy CGI flames. Sambot boring us with yet more of his "I'm the best hunter, ever" shtick. Woobie Hell Sammy. And none of it had anything to do with the season plot, so what was it doing in half of the season finale?
ReplyDeleteDean's hell was shown. Its effects were clearly demonstrated. They were scary. We got it. We didn't need to revisit it with a carbon-copy version for Sam. And Dean has not been portrayed for six solid seasons with only one character arc--there's something wrong with him! The first time it came up that Sam might have something wrong with him, there was some mystery to it. Now, it's like, "Turn the page, show."
There is nothing new to see here with Sam's hellpain. If there were, we'd have seen it last season, when it was still relevant. I get that mileage varies and all that, but there are excellent reasons for why that plot didn't work for a lot of fans and there is nothing negative about pointing them out.
Also, more to the point, if the only reason to bring back dead characters is to show them in Sam's hallucinations, that will get old fast. Remember how underwhelming YED's appearance in Exile on Main Street turned out to be when we found out he wasn't real? Like that. I don't get why fans scream and yell about powerful characters like Death and God being around as dei ex machina, yet aren't bothered by story concepts with built-in Magic Reset Buttons. There are no story consequences to Lucifer being Sam's hallucination, aside from giving Sam (and us) a temporary scare. It's lazy.
Now, if they want to do something original like explore Nick's possible relation to the brothers or have something happen with Lucifer and Michael that doesn't bring them back as the whiners they turned into in Swan Song, or sideline the brothers in their own story, I'm all for it. Pellegrino's a great actor. There are good ways to bring him back and that might be what we end up with. Bringing him back as a Lucifer hallucination? Not so good.
I think it would be helpful for Sam's character development to really see what happened in the cage and that would require some Lucifer time. My only question is who exactly saw him, from the original tweets we never got the name of the mysterious "person she was following" that saw MP.
ReplyDeleteMark Pellegrino in Supernatural was fantastic... great news if it's true.... and what about Gabriel?! :D
ReplyDeleteI guess it would be pretty cool if they found a good way to bring him back. I've loved the guy ever since I saw him in Dexter, he's such an amazing actor.
ReplyDeleteI hope mark's back even if only briefly/in flash-back as I loved him as Lucifer.
ReplyDeleteMaybe it was one of Sam's flashbacks from the cage???
ReplyDeletethat didnt even cross my mind! genius.
ReplyDeleteProbably Flashback.
ReplyDeleteI would LOVE this even if it is just a split sec of a scene! it would be fantastic!
ReplyDeleteYay! (assuming it's a Sam flashback or hallucination). I liked Pellegrino as Lucifer, and I'd like to see see more of the interactions between Sam and Luci after they went into the cage. We had five years of suggestions that Sam belongs on the dark/demon side, even though the only Sam we saw was a very kind person with occasional anger issues. Season 5's finale included a conversation between Luci and Sam in which Luci says that Sam was always drawn to him and that Sam felt an "exhileration" with being connected with Luci. I want to hear Sam's response to this. I also want to know if Sam still has his anger, if he still has his powers, if him being "the boy king" gave him a different relationship with demons. I want the gaps filled in and his five-season story arc tied up properly.
ReplyDeleteCreepy.. these are all my tweets.
ReplyDeleteAnyway maybe Mark's return has something to do with Sam's wall falling down or maybe even a flashback.
The least thing would be if Castiel did something in order to release Lucifer.. or maybe GODCastiel! has plans to smite Lucifer?!
I guess we'll just have to wait and see!!
The way to make people care about a story is to write a story and show what happened, and it seems like that's what they're doing. Sam has a different backstory, was brought to Hell for a different reason than Dean, and was with Lucifer and Michael, so it's unlikely that Sam's story will be a carbon-copy of Dean's.
ReplyDeletei know they are currently filiming season 2 of being human, but i cant remember if mark died in the first season finale LOL....anyways, be cool to see him back as lucifer :D
ReplyDeletehuh? now i'm just confused, will probably be a flashback
ReplyDeleteWhat if Cas is so powerdrunk that he thinks he can actually extinct all evil by killing Lucifer and Michael?
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry, but I really don't see that happening, considering what Jared has told us, Hell memories/flashes/hallucinations make more sense.
ReplyDeleteholy crap if that is true then i bet maybe Castiel that stuck up 'god' wanted maybe to show his power off with a challenge and fighting lucifer. So maybe he released him but Lucifer escaped the fight? Or maybe Lucifer lost his powers when escaping.
ReplyDeleteno he didnt die Lucifer was left in the cage with Michael and Adam when Castiel and Crowley got Sam out.
ReplyDeleteI WOULDNT COUNT ON IT BEING MEMORIES GUYS!!!!
ReplyDeleteIf it were memories from hell then where is Jake Abel who played Adam and Michael? They were with him in hell? Dont count on it. If anything maybe lucifer's soul is talking to him somehow but dont count on it being memories.
Sounds to me like you're bitter Sam spent more time in Hell than Dean and that we're actually going to get to see what happened to him in Hell this season.
ReplyDeleteYes, he died.
ReplyDeleteSince these are all your tweets, maybe you could provide us with more information as to who saw Mark and if it's honestly true so we can have some real confirmation that Mark may actually be back?
ReplyDeletei follow someone who lives in Vancouver and likes tracking down where the cast and crew shoot the show and she tweeted that Mark Pellegrino was on set shooting. Oh and they were shooting at some sort of bar.
ReplyDeleteAh, I see. So did she actually see him shooting with Jared and Jensen? Who was he shooting with? Is she positive it was the Supernatural set?
ReplyDeleteoh mm cas !! I really can't wait for season 7....I guess sam might be having flashbacks after all
ReplyDeleteYou are basically saying that they skipped Sam's Hell Story in Season 6, so why bother in 7? You also said that they showed enough of it when they really didn't show anything at all. It sounds like they can't make you care about anything having to do with "wooby" Sam. It will only satisfy you if they cover Sam's time in Hell through different characters. Why don't we tell the whole story of the Winchesters through other characters and give Jared and Jensen a nice long vacation.... NOPE, not gonna happen.
ReplyDeleteUhhh Lucifer is an angel. He doesn't have a soul.
ReplyDeleteWell this season's all about Sam's wall, maybe they're showing flashbacks or something. I don't think he's BACK :)
ReplyDeleteOh great! There's one character I never want to see back on Supernatural again. Weepy Lucifer was a downpoint for the series. This better be a flash back or a nightmare and a short one at that. I do not want to go through Lucifer's daddy issues again.
ReplyDeleteYes, they pretty much said he couldn't hold Lucifer. Considering everyone else died, he should be dead too. This would be the worst retcon of them all if he comes back.
ReplyDeleteI'm leaning towards very, very bad. Can't we be done with Lame Lucifer? We already made it through the Apocalypse.
ReplyDeleteI would much rather see him on The Closer than Supernatural. He's a good actor trapped in a terrible character on this show. He deserves a better part.
ReplyDeleteI doubt there was a bar in hell, although with Crowley who knows. My guess is this is one of those times when Sam can't tell what is real and what isn't. A waking nightmare of some sort.
ReplyDeleteNot memories per se but more Lucifer taunting him in his dreams/hallucinations. Kind of like Lilith going after Dean in Yellow Fever. She wasn't really there but it seemed real at the time.
ReplyDeleteNo freaking kidding! I'd hope it is a small part of the season because half a season of Sam angst is not appealing to me. I want action, wins, and brothers fighting monsters together.
ReplyDeleteI'd prefer to see Sam as Lucifer. The white suit look was good on him.
ReplyDeleteHey maybe the boys randomly run into Lucifer's discarded meat suit in the bar - maybe Mark's not Lucifer at all? We don't know what happened to Nick after Luci swapped suits. That could happen. Maybe.
ReplyDeleteInteresting idea. I don't think they will go there but it does suit Cas' new pesonality. My question is do Michael and Lucifer have a physical form in the cage? They were borrowing Adam and Sam, but obviously Cas was able to get Sam's form out if not his soul. So Lucifer must have detached from Sam relatively quickly.
ReplyDeleteI agree that Lucifer as a hallucination is even less scary than Lucifer in decaying flesh and he was underwhelming in that construct. I'd had enough of both Michael and Lucifer by Swan Song too. If we get them back it will sideline the brothers again and I don't need anymore of that.
ReplyDeleteLet's hope it isn't ALL about Sam's wall. I think we've got confirmation there is a Big Bad out there somewhere. :-)
ReplyDeleteSee, I actually don't feel that way because Lucifer WAS scary to me, so I guess it just depends on the viewer.
ReplyDeleteThat meat suit was pretty gooey and rotty....Nick was a decaying mess by the end of his stint as Lucifer's Angel condom. My bet, if this is true, it's part of Sam's wall issues and not being able to distinguish between reality and his memorie of the pit. They've sad that his wall is going to impact on his ability to perceive what is real or not....I'd say, he's seeing things. Awesome news though, totally dig Mark P and as awkward as this always is to say, just loved Lucifer!
ReplyDeleteSince my post was deleted and I have no idea why considering I wasn't nasty or rude or attacking the characters unlike this post...
ReplyDelete"Sambot boring us with yet more of
his "I'm the best hunter, ever" shtick. Woobie Hell Sammy."
Judging by all of this, I'm gathering you've attempted to discreetly find a reason to attack Sam, referring to his Hell self as "Woobie Hell Sammy" kinda gives that away. Not so discreet, fyi.
"Dean's hell was shown. Its effects were clearly demonstrated. They were
scary. We got it. We didn't need to revisit it with a carbon-copy
version for Sam."
And what makes you think that this is going to be a carbon-copy version for Sam if I may ask? I certainly don't see Sam's Hell as a carbon-copy. Especially considering Sam jumped into Hell body AND soul under completely different circumstances, and especially considering that Sam was in an entirely DIFFERENT part of Hell than what Dean was and not on the rack or surrounded by demons, but instead trapped in Lucifer's cage with Michael and Lucifer UNLIKE what Dean went through.
So please answer me exactly how Dean's Hell compared to Sam's Hell is a "carbon-copy" as you put it, because I'm not seeing it. To me, it sounds like you're angry because Sam now has a Hell storyline that they didn't just leave hanging up in the air, to which I'm grateful they didn't because fans of Sam deserve to know and Sam has a character deserves to have it explored.
You claim there is nothing new to see here with Sam's Hell experience, just how exactly do you know this? Are you close friends with the writers or something? I mean I'm bordering on sheer curiosity here since you seem to know so much about Sam and what he went through while in Hell.
I liked Lucifer when he wasn't going on and on about his daddy issues.
ReplyDeleteWhile Jared was incredible playing Lucifer, I'd rather not see him as Lucifer again. But I do concur; he looked really good in the white suit.
ReplyDeleteI'm with you, it's got to be a flashback episode of maybe Sam's time in Hell. He can't be out the cage again. They did that storyline already!
ReplyDeleteIf MP is on the show and if Sam is flashing back, there is a reason for it that will advance the story. Screenwriting 101, every line advances the story. So, something that Lucifer does to him in the cage must affect the plot line in Season 7. No Michael and no Adam because they didn't torture him, hello?! Michael in Adam is more than capable of hitting Lucy without touching Sam, whereas Lucifer has Sam all tied up in his head. Still would LOVE to get independent verification. Anyone get verification of this from another source than "I follow someone who saw but I won't tell you who I follow"?
ReplyDeleteOr they run into Nick's twin brother? ;P
ReplyDeleteI liked Lucifer when he was only a threat in the talks, in season 4. He lost all of his scariness in the moment he actually appeared and started talking. With the exception of The End and Jared's kick ass performance.
ReplyDeleteOr maybe it's some creepy doppelganger monster.
ReplyDeleteOr maybe it's meta gone wild and Mark's playing himself *cringes* Hope Dahne doesn't read this :P
lol maybe it's Mark playing himself having a twin brother named Nick xD
ReplyDeleteI hope they wrap up the Hell storyline by the first half of the season. I'm not looking forward to dealing with more Hell memories. We went through this already with Dean.
ReplyDeleteI agree. He was a lot scarier before he appeared on the show. They were aiming for sympathetic and hit pathetic instead.
ReplyDeletethank you Jilly. Now this episode seems even worse. :-P Or maybe it can't be possibly worse than what I'm now thinking. Yeah, that's how I'm going to look at it.
ReplyDeleteWho escaped from a weird island where time had no meaning?
ReplyDeleteI agree, How is Paula's "Sambot boring us with yet more of his "I'm the best hunter, ever" shtick. Woobie Hell Sammy" not offensive?
ReplyDeleteI'm certain that we won't have Luci (or even Mikey) in the flesh, but I loved Lucifer!Nick and thought he was very scary. We going to have to agree to disagree with this one.
ReplyDeleteIt was the show's attempt to have the fans "see" *anvil like parallels* between Lucifer and Sam that annoyed me more. (Leaving your family for a full ride at college makes you the Devil brother ;-) ).
I doubt MP's presence for a few moments even on a recurring basis will sideline the boys.
Sam is not a real person. Therefore, I can't insult him. I would appreciate it if you didn't use my opinion of a fictional character to insult *me*, as I am quite real.
ReplyDeleteAs I said above, I get that some people would want to see this and that mileage varies, and that's okay. But I don't. I saw enough of Sam's Hell storyline last season to feel it was done poorly and that it didn't get any better the more they did it. I also disagree that it wasn't covered enough. It was covered to death.
We had Dean worrying that something was wrong with Sam for the first six episodes of season six. Then we had Dean worrying about Sam's soul in the cage for another five episodes (while being told by several characters, in excruciating detail, what it was like for Sam in the cage). Then we had the aftermath in the following episode, and Sam having flashbacks in the next, and three episodes after that, we had Samuel beating Sam up about what he did without his soul. Four episodes later, it came up again as a reason for a major break between two other characters, and then half of the season finale was sacrificed to Sam's reintegration inside his own head, even though it had nothing to do with what was going in the outside world and we had a whole bunch of other plot threads that needed tying up.
Other, quite viable, storylines were cut short or rushed so that we could revisit this storyline that wasn't even part of the major season plot. Sam didn't grow for half a season because it turned out he wasn't "really" Sam, and Sambot was written in a wildly inconsistent manner, so I don't see how that did Sam as a character any favours. We never got enough of a break from the storyline to miss it and now, they want to spend *another* season on it? Really?
Isn't there a point where these writers are going to realize that this plot isn't working, hasn't worked from the beginning, and they just need to throw in the towel and end it? They've ended plenty of other storylines in the past because they didn't work, including Dean's hell storyline (because, Kripke said outright, it would be too boring to watch either Dean or Sam turn into a drooling mess in a corner). How is this one any different?
Now, bringing back Mark Pellegrino? I'm all for that. But since one of the biggest fan objections to last season was the way they brought back dead characters, only to ruin them (like Samuel), that doesn't mean I want him to come back for something so pointless, that could easily be written in such a way that it wouldn't require a guest star of that calibre.
Really missed him in the show... He's in so many of my shows its not even funny. But he is a hell of an actor.
ReplyDeletein one of the episodes, sam will be having hallucinations because of his memories so this could be one of them...we'll see cant wait!!!!!
ReplyDelete