See I'm not sure Sam's soul is even still in the cage. And Cas has been.......um.......not exactly helpful so far...... nothing is as it seems.....nothing is as it seems......... But yes- if Sam's souls HAS been in the cage all this time it will be somewhat the worse for wear...... maybe the Impala can fix him.......(the most important object in the universe?)
And if Sam's soul is in the cage, and they've been taking out their frustrations on him, it's not like they have weapons or access to devices of torture... it's a cage... a prison created by Heaven. If Dean could deal with 40 years of actual torture and come out of it a functioning human being, I'm guessing Sam can, too. Yeah, he's been there longer, but maybe they've all become buddies. :) Michael is an angel, right? Dick or not, I don't think God would condone him 'taking out his frustrations' on a human soul, and Michael is all about being the 'good son'. I don't know. I don't think it's all as cut and dried as Cas is making it out to be. I think he has an agenda here and it's not conducive to Sam getting his soul back. Just a hunch.
I'm convinced Cas is hiding something important - no idea what - but he's been known to be a dick before, so anything's possible.......... I've been wondering if Sam maybe gave up his soul voluntarily - maybe to protect Dean? Hell, I don't know - I've had a couple of wines so anything looks plausible ;P
Thanks for sharing the happy news Cas. You're the buzzkill of the party. Question - wouldn't Michael and Lucifer be taking their frustrations out on each other? I mean they have been fighting for...um..eternity. I think they have some major sibling issues to work out. Sam's soul would be the least of their attention.
I have faith that Sam will return all soul-angsty by the middle of the second half. Perhaps Cas doesn't really know what he is talking about, Sam is a special soul, or there are far bigger things at play here and this is the misdirect. Cas if you are betraying the Winchesters I hope they salt and burn your keister. If it works for demons...
Cas is definitely hiding something from the class. Now the question is will it end up being a side thing that has no bearing on what has happened so far or will it be a betrayal to the Winchesters. I'm hoping for side project since the Winchesters can't keep taking hits. They're not Weebles folks. They do fall down.
This is SPN - the fairy godmother would end up twisting every wish until you wished you never wished before. Kind of like that episode of X-Files where Mulder wished for peace on earth and all the people vanished. (Bwah - that was funny) Although if the fairy godmother was a cross between anime Bobby and anime Missouri it could be a riot. Imagine the fairy godmother being an enforcer for the mob. Or a Crowley groupie.
OK - definitely time for some sleep. Ideas are coming fast and absurd.
Heh, I wish. You know, you may be right and Sam's soul may not be in the cage but I think it's more interesting if it is, at least to me anyway. I like wondering just how messed up it's going to be when Sam gets it back.
I kind of hope that Cas is hiding something. We were all told Cas was going back to being the old shady, dick of an angel he used to be, but we really haven't seen that yet.
Mostly because we haven't seen him yet. Instead of being a recurring character, he's more like a pop-in or perhaps he's starting an Angel FedEx. Come drop the idea (or bad, bad news in Cas' case) and head off to make someone else's day worse.
Right.......that probably means I'm at least part demon myself....dammit. Oh wait, I'm a zealous fan, not an overzealous fan......phew......now I can relax. ;P
I wouldn't call it an angel FedEx. It's more like he's an angel cable guy. He never shows up when you want him to and when he does it's too late or extremely inconvenient.
I'm assuming it's going to be better in the second half of the season when the Cas storyline builds steam.
Archangels have bigger imaginations than just about anybody...remember Raphael? Also we're talking about Satan himself, not just some random demon. And God? I don't think God cares anymore considering what he's let his angels do.
Maybe he could have killed his brother in hell, and so he, Sam, and ADAM [who everyone seems to have forgotten. ;A;] are doing their best to .. 'chill' while in Hell.. ;w; I'd like that sort of direction.
LOL I wish. I don't think we'd get that lucky though. I remember Sera saying that Michael and Lucifer are trapped forever in that cage to fight each other for all eternity.
Sam was the one who ruined Michael and Lucifer's apocalypse plans. If Sam is there, they're not exactly going to be very happy to have him down there. If they've got the chance to take it out on the one who screwed up their plans and ruined things for them, I imagine they're gonna come after him first before each other.
Thank you, I really didn`t understand it right, did I? It would be nice for the not native english people to get the words. Sometimes I found on Youtube the clip already with the words, but it`s not often. I think I should put the side to my favorites, but for now I don`t have it! The next time I try to fix it. Does someone know a poster who puts up the clip with the words pretty fast, maybe ?
I believe that Cas knows more than he is letting on, but as an angel, it most likely comes with the territory. I wonder myself just how Sam will be when he does get his soul back. Will he remember what he did to Cas and Bobby just before going into the cage? Will he remember everything he did in the past year-a lot we don't know? Most importantly, will he be able to forgive himself and move on? Dean might not know what to do, but he does know that he will do anything to save his brother. He always seems to be at least one step ahead of the rest of us, so it makes sense that he will save Sam in some way. I think that this will be bittersweet in a way once things are back to "normal", but it seems like right now it has been a long enough road. I want the old Sam back!
They wouldnt in a way becuase it was Sam's fault that there stuck in the cage. Sam took control of Lucifer and jumped in the whole, and Dragged Micheal with them. So they would blame him and take it out on him becuase it is his fault they are there to begining with.
i believe sam heard that conversation, maybe he wake up n keep pretending unconscious when cas zapp him n heard they talking, see in promo space when sam in the impala trunk.., look his face...., he know something..., ^o^
I wouldn't be shocked if it turns out that Sam never even went to Hell. For example, one way it could happen is that when they started falling, Lucifer lashed out at Sam and sent his soul flying far away from his body.
Wouldn't it be funny if Sam's soul latched on to the Impala the way spirits are sometimes connected to objects? When we first saw roboSam, he didn't want to ride in the Impala. And Dean made a comment a few episodes back that he didn't want roboSam in his car. Sam's soul may have been in Dean's garage this whole past year.
I'm so excited to see the last two episodes of 2010... but it's gonna be one hell of a long winter hellatus if we don't get Sam's soul back in episode 11. Which we probably won't. Ahhhhh!! I love this show so much but this soul business is killing me! :)
I hope so! It would be utterly disappointing if, after everything they put us through, Sam gets his soul back and they just go to a bar and have a beer.
Then again, everybody expects Sam to be messed up and this is SPN. Not everything is as it seems...(This sentence is still frying my nervs).
Anyway, I want Sam to be messed up, so that we can see, his time in hell was horrible. Otherwise his whole self-sacrifice to stop the apocalypse would seem insignificant.
They may take it out on Sam ´cause he´s an easy prey.
If Luci and old brother wanted to vent their frustrations, they would not do it on an equal strong opponent with little hope of winning (because losing or getting nothing out of it would anger them further). And like Karen Slinger said, it was Sam´s fault. We´ve seen some of the things Lucifer did to others (hammer of the Gods).
I can´t imagine, what he´d been capable of doing to Sam...and I can imagine so many things!
I agree Airbat - the writers will not just put everything right with a beer in a bar (or on the hood of the Impala. That would mean everything leading up to the soul's return was a waste of time...........they (the writers) are far too intelligent to do that to the fans (and to Sam).
The problem I have with that is that Michael is supposed to be an archangel, not a fallen angel like Lucifer. Using someone's soul for a punching back with no possible way of defending itself is pretty evil. So, if they're going to say that's whats happened, they'd better turn Michael full-on evil. It wouldn't make sense otherwise.
You're right Airbat - nothing is ever easy with SPN - that's part of its appeal.......... Those boys just keep on going no matter what gods, demons, angels or monsters throw at them. You go get those dickbags guys......
Lucifer has been an archangel too, once. Look where he endet...
And Michael had been a dick too. He let Zacharia (or how was the dick called?) manipulate Dean to get his apocalypse, so he can fullfill his destiny. Mike must have known about that. Doesn´t seem very arch or angel like to me. I have no love lost for Michael.
Poor SAM! I was expecting that though of course how could you not...I hope it leads to some nice brotherly comfort moments though. And even though thats what I knew would be the case all along for Sam's soul, hearing Cas say it made me feel so sad and nervous...
Exactly! If Lucifer and Michael are together in the cage, would they really notice the little human soul crouching in the corner? These two have immense egos (they are archangels after all) with a milennium of bad blood between them, so I can't see them wasting a lot of effort on Sam. What exactly makes Cas so sure? I decided not to believe anything until there's proof this season. I'm not about to simply believe it because Castiel says so. I don't trust him.
I can't wait until tonight's episode, but this sneak peek just really depresses me. :(
It makes what they're all about to do even more risky! The possibility of Sam's soul being damage while still in the pit had never occurred to me before, and God does that have me worried for the bros. Now what's going to happen? This is why I hate ultimatums! But I predict this episode to be a good one.
Oooo.., i can't imagine, 1 little soul, sit in the corner anxiety..., wait who from the 2 (the devil n the higher archangel) will came first to torture him then the next one, without have capability to defend himself.., maybe mike n luci play scissor n paper to decide who have fun first O_o
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Hey, alright. Cas said what I've been thinking for weeks now. I figure that soul will be pretty messed up when Sam gets it back.
ReplyDeleteSee I'm not sure Sam's soul is even still in the cage. And Cas has been.......um.......not exactly helpful so far...... nothing is as it seems.....nothing is as it seems.........
ReplyDeleteBut yes- if Sam's souls HAS been in the cage all this time it will be somewhat the worse for wear...... maybe the Impala can fix him.......(the most important object in the universe?)
If Sam's soul is as "unique" as I believe it is, then being in the cage for all that time won't matter all that much.
ReplyDeleteAnd if Sam's soul is in the cage, and they've been taking out their frustrations on him, it's not like they have weapons or access to devices of torture... it's a cage... a prison created by Heaven. If Dean could deal with 40 years of actual torture and come out of it a functioning human being, I'm guessing Sam can, too. Yeah, he's been there longer, but maybe they've all become buddies. :) Michael is an angel, right? Dick or not, I don't think God would condone him 'taking out his frustrations' on a human soul, and Michael is all about being the 'good son'. I don't know. I don't think it's all as cut and dried as Cas is making it out to be. I think he has an agenda here and it's not conducive to Sam getting his soul back. Just a hunch.
ReplyDeleteI'm convinced Cas is hiding something important - no idea what - but he's been known to be a dick before, so anything's possible..........
ReplyDeleteI've been wondering if Sam maybe gave up his soul voluntarily - maybe to protect Dean? Hell, I don't know - I've had a couple of wines so anything looks plausible ;P
I hope you're right Bruce - but then, as I've said before, you always are ;P
ReplyDeleteThanks for sharing the happy news Cas. You're the buzzkill of the party. Question - wouldn't Michael and Lucifer be taking their frustrations out on each other? I mean they have been fighting for...um..eternity. I think they have some major sibling issues to work out. Sam's soul would be the least of their attention.
ReplyDeleteI have faith that Sam will return all soul-angsty by the middle of the second half. Perhaps Cas doesn't really know what he is talking about, Sam is a special soul, or there are far bigger things at play here and this is the misdirect. Cas if you are betraying the Winchesters I hope they salt and burn your keister. If it works for demons...
Cas is definitely hiding something from the class. Now the question is will it end up being a side thing that has no bearing on what has happened so far or will it be a betrayal to the Winchesters. I'm hoping for side project since the Winchesters can't keep taking hits. They're not Weebles folks. They do fall down.
ReplyDeleteWeebles - thank you Dahne - I needed a good laugh ;P
ReplyDeleteIf he's messing with the boys I will salt and burn his keister MYSELF ;P
This is SPN - the fairy godmother would end up twisting every wish until you wished you never wished before. Kind of like that episode of X-Files where Mulder wished for peace on earth and all the people vanished. (Bwah - that was funny) Although if the fairy godmother was a cross between anime Bobby and anime Missouri it could be a riot. Imagine the fairy godmother being an enforcer for the mob. Or a Crowley groupie.
ReplyDeleteOK - definitely time for some sleep. Ideas are coming fast and absurd.
Heh, I wish. You know, you may be right and Sam's soul may not be in the cage but I think it's more interesting if it is, at least to me anyway. I like wondering just how messed up it's going to be when Sam gets it back.
ReplyDeleteHope you've got a place to hide Bruce cause I'm betting the Samgirls will be after you for saying that ;P
ReplyDeleteI kind of hope that Cas is hiding something. We were all told Cas was going back to being the old shady, dick of an angel he used to be, but we really haven't seen that yet.
ReplyDeleteBring 'em on, jillyanne. You know I don't back down. ;)
ReplyDeleteCan I hide behind you then?
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely. I'll go get my holy water.
ReplyDeleteOooh..... I could get my SuperSoaker waterpistol - wait - holy water? - are you saying they're demons??
ReplyDeleteYes, absolutely. Overzealous fans are at least slightly demonic.
ReplyDelete"wouldn't Michael and Lucifer be taking their frustrations out on each other?"
ReplyDeleteBingo. This is one of the reasons why people think Cas is acting shady. Why would he not come to that conclusion?
Mostly because we haven't seen him yet. Instead of being a recurring character, he's more like a pop-in or perhaps he's starting an Angel FedEx. Come drop the idea (or bad, bad news in Cas' case) and head off to make someone else's day worse.
ReplyDeleteRight.......that probably means I'm at least part demon myself....dammit.
ReplyDeleteOh wait, I'm a zealous fan, not an overzealous fan......phew......now I can relax. ;P
I wouldn't call it an angel FedEx. It's more like he's an angel cable guy. He never shows up when you want him to and when he does it's too late or extremely inconvenient.
ReplyDeleteI'm assuming it's going to be better in the second half of the season when the Cas storyline builds steam.
Haha .........I am totally calling Cas 'angel cable guy' from now on :)
ReplyDeleteCas stop saying out loud what everyone was thinking...you,re breaking my heart ;-;
ReplyDeleteYou raise a good point. Sam's soul did withstand the Devil. He was able to overcome the Devil and best him as well.
ReplyDeleteArchangels have bigger imaginations than just about anybody...remember Raphael? Also we're talking about Satan himself, not just some random demon. And God? I don't think God cares anymore considering what he's let his angels do.
ReplyDeleteMaybe he could have killed his brother in hell, and so he, Sam, and ADAM [who everyone seems to have forgotten. ;A;] are doing their best to .. 'chill' while in Hell.. ;w; I'd like that sort of direction.
ReplyDeleteLOL I wish. I don't think we'd get that lucky though. I remember Sera saying that Michael and Lucifer are trapped forever in that cage to fight each other for all eternity.
ReplyDeleteSam was the one who ruined Michael and Lucifer's apocalypse plans. If Sam is there, they're not exactly going to be very happy to have him down there. If they've got the chance to take it out on the one who screwed up their plans and ruined things for them, I imagine they're gonna come after him first before each other.
ReplyDeleteWhat did Castiel say?
ReplyDeleteIf we put the needle in Sam`s scull we have no idea what happens?Is this right?
Please does someone write their words here? I am from germany!
"if we try to force that mutilated thing down Sam's gullet, we have no idea what could happen" - Sam's gullet = Sam's throat
ReplyDeleteIf Sam accidentally (or not) overheard this conversation, it's not more than reasonable that he doesn't want his soul back...
ReplyDeleteThank you, I really didn`t understand it right, did I? It would be nice for the not native english people to get the words. Sometimes I found on Youtube the clip already with the words, but it`s not often. I think I should put the side to my favorites, but for now I don`t have it! The next time I try to fix it. Does someone know a poster who puts up the clip with the words pretty fast, maybe ?
ReplyDeleteI believe that Cas knows more than he is letting on, but as an angel, it most likely comes with the territory. I wonder myself just how Sam will be when he does get his soul back. Will he remember what he did to Cas and Bobby just before going into the cage? Will he remember everything he did in the past year-a lot we don't know? Most importantly, will he be able to forgive himself and move on? Dean might not know what to do, but he does know that he will do anything to save his brother. He always seems to be at least one step ahead of the rest of us, so it makes sense that he will save Sam in some way. I think that this will be bittersweet in a way once things are back to "normal", but it seems like right now it has been a long enough road. I want the old Sam back!
ReplyDeleteThey wouldnt in a way becuase it was Sam's fault that there stuck in the cage. Sam took control of Lucifer and jumped in the whole, and Dragged Micheal with them. So they would blame him and take it out on him becuase it is his fault they are there to begining with.
ReplyDeleteI really hate Cas sometimes, he probably knows something but isn't saying it >:(
ReplyDeleteJust wondering though, how could a messed up soul affect someone once it gets back into their body? Like would Sam go crazy or something?
WELL DUH hehehe :P
ReplyDeleteI'm still going with the theory that Dean has Sam's soul, but doesn't know it. It would explain the shift in Dean's character.
ReplyDeletei believe sam heard that conversation, maybe he wake up n keep pretending unconscious when cas zapp him n heard they talking, see in promo space when sam in the impala trunk.., look his face...., he know something..., ^o^
ReplyDeleteCas and Dean ♥ And awwwe, poor Sam :(
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't be shocked if it turns out that Sam never even went to Hell. For example, one way it could happen is that when they started falling, Lucifer lashed out at Sam and sent his soul flying far away from his body.
ReplyDeleteWouldn't it be funny if Sam's soul latched on to the Impala the way spirits are sometimes connected to objects? When we first saw roboSam, he didn't want to ride in the Impala. And Dean made a comment a few episodes back that he didn't want roboSam in his car. Sam's soul may have been in Dean's garage this whole past year.
That´s a really interesting thought.
ReplyDeleteWith only one act it would redeem Sam and quiet down the anti-Sam campaign.
But is it ever this easy with SPN? I fear not.
I'm so excited to see the last two episodes of 2010... but it's gonna be one hell of a long winter hellatus if we don't get Sam's soul back in episode 11. Which we probably won't.
ReplyDeleteAhhhhh!! I love this show so much but this soul business is killing me! :)
I hope so! It would be utterly disappointing if, after everything they put us through, Sam gets his soul back and they just go to a bar and have a beer.
ReplyDeleteThen again, everybody expects Sam to be messed up and this is SPN. Not everything is as it seems...(This sentence is still frying my nervs).
Anyway, I want Sam to be messed up, so that we can see, his time in hell was horrible. Otherwise his whole self-sacrifice to stop the apocalypse would seem insignificant.
They may take it out on Sam ´cause he´s an easy prey.
ReplyDeleteIf Luci and old brother wanted to vent their frustrations, they would not do it on an equal strong opponent with little hope of winning (because losing or getting nothing out of it would anger them further).
And like Karen Slinger said, it was Sam´s fault. We´ve seen some of the things Lucifer did to others (hammer of the Gods).
I can´t imagine, what he´d been capable of doing to Sam...and I can imagine so many things!
I agree Airbat - the writers will not just put everything right with a beer in a bar (or on the hood of the Impala.
ReplyDeleteThat would mean everything leading up to the soul's return was a waste of time...........they (the writers) are far too intelligent to do that to the fans (and to Sam).
Agreed. I want soulless Sam to turn into Charles Bronson Sam.
ReplyDeleteThe problem I have with that is that Michael is supposed to be an archangel, not a fallen angel like Lucifer. Using someone's soul for a punching back with no possible way of defending itself is pretty evil. So, if they're going to say that's whats happened, they'd better turn Michael full-on evil. It wouldn't make sense otherwise.
ReplyDeleteYou're right Airbat - nothing is ever easy with SPN - that's part of its appeal..........
ReplyDeleteThose boys just keep on going no matter what gods, demons, angels or monsters throw at them.
You go get those dickbags guys......
Lucifer has been an archangel too, once. Look where he endet...
ReplyDeleteAnd Michael had been a dick too. He let Zacharia (or how was the dick called?) manipulate Dean to get his apocalypse, so he can fullfill his destiny. Mike must have known about that. Doesn´t seem very arch or angel like to me. I have no love lost for Michael.
I can't wait for tomorrow!
ReplyDeletePoor Sammy's going to be so messed up when his soul returns. I can't wait for the angst!
Poor SAM! I was expecting that though of course how could you not...I hope it leads to some nice brotherly comfort moments though. And even though thats what I knew would be the case all along for Sam's soul, hearing Cas say it made me feel so sad and nervous...
ReplyDeleteExactly! If Lucifer and Michael are together in the cage, would they really notice the little human soul crouching in the corner? These two have immense egos (they are archangels after all) with a milennium of bad blood between them, so I can't see them wasting a lot of effort on Sam. What exactly makes Cas so sure? I decided not to believe anything until there's proof this season. I'm not about to simply believe it because Castiel says so. I don't trust him.
ReplyDeleteI kind of like this theory. And it would make Ash's 'soul mates' line back in Dark Side of the Moon when they were in Heaven make a lot more sense.
ReplyDeleteI can't wait until tonight's episode, but this sneak peek just really depresses me. :(
ReplyDeleteIt makes what they're all about to do even more risky! The possibility of Sam's soul being damage while still in the pit had never occurred to me before, and God does that have me worried for the bros. Now what's going to happen? This is why I hate ultimatums! But I predict this episode to be a good one.
Oooo.., i can't imagine, 1 little soul, sit in the corner anxiety..., wait who from the 2 (the devil n the higher archangel) will came first to torture him then the next one, without have capability to defend himself.., maybe mike n luci play scissor n paper to decide who have fun first O_o
ReplyDeleteadded the last word, "it could be catastrophic"
ReplyDelete